Battery Cables

Bernie Steffen · Dec 16, 2009

Was wondering what the thoughts were on size of battery cables when using six volt starter and twelve volt system. My M Farmall doesn't seem to turn over as it should with a twelve volt system. Starter has been rebuilt. Not using the big cables necessary when using six volt system. Any Ideas appreciated. Bernie Steffen

Andrew Z · Dec 16, 2009

6 volt at leat 00 gauge. 12 volt 2 gauge min. thermal breakdown can hurt wires, you can not see this. perhaps you have old wires that need to be replaced ?

Andrew

Bernie Steffen · Dec 16, 2009

Andrew. Cables new when tractor was done two years ago. Made from welding cable(new) soldered ends. thanks Bernie Steffen

Andrew Z · Dec 16, 2009

thats good welding cable is the best wire to use. maybe poor connections at the post ? have you had the battery load tested to verify its good, not just with a volt meter. how many CCA does the battery have ? trying to just go down the list in my mind here.

Andrew

John T · Dec 16, 2009

Bernie, My friend and fellow sparkie Bob M had this discussion a while back, heres our thoughts as I recall.

1) Since 12 volts on a 6 volt tractor can be a bit tough on starter drives, I suggested use of a smaller less CCA battery to soften that blow somewhat.

2) Then Bob M says heyyyyyyyyy I still like a big heavy honkin batetry in case its colddddddd so he suggested in that case to use smaller cables (which can drop more voltage)

On 6 volt I like 00 gauge and at least 1 gauge on 12 volt so take Bob or my suggestion (smaller cables or smaller battery) if youre worried about premature starter drive failure. HOWEVER heck it will still work okay either way with either size of cables, we sparkies tend to overanalyze these things lol

John T

Owen Aaland · Dec 16, 2009

The volt meter is your friend to find any problems here. While cranking there should be no more than .1 volt drop between any two consecutive connection points. No more that .2 volts drop across the switch. Be sure to check voltage drop between the starter case and the grounded battery terminal. The battery should maintain at least 9.5 volts, 10 volts or more would be better. Low battery voltage will be caused by either a weak battery or excessive draw in the starter. A battery load test will determine which one is at fault.

Bernie Steffen · Dec 16, 2009

Okay here goes. Battery was new when the tractor was done. Two years ago. Don't remember cca. Battery is under the seat and I didn't take time to take seat off and check. Starter never seems to have the whomp it should. Even; in hot weather. Sooooo as John T says. back to the drawing boards. New oversize cables, redo the starter again, if that doesn't do it,New bigger battery. Wouldn't hardly start today. 24 degrees. Hasn't been started for three months. thanks for all Ideas. Bernie Steffen

CNKS · Dec 16, 2009

With 12 volts, 2 or 4 gauge is ok. The starter does not care what the voltage is. The most important thing is to have clean connections, and be sure there is no corrosion inside the cable near the connection. The biggest problems are the 24 degrees and not starting it for 3 months. I often run into the same problem as I only run my tractors in the winter if I need to blade snow, in SW KS, that is not very often. It helps to charge the battery first, use no choke when cranking to prevent flooding, if it fires, try to pull out the choke slightly before it dies. Your problem is normal for an H or M, no big deal.

gene bender · Dec 17, 2009

Easy way to check cables is when turning the engine over put you fingers on all the terminals which ever one is warm is sign of a bad one. I would get new ones clean the batt terminals and also the foot operated sw then it should realy turn over great unless your starter is bad and thats maybe why they converted it to shart with as they satered with 6v when things were in shape. Now seems like just cant wait untill its cjanged to 12v.

Brownie 450 · Dec 17, 2009

Battery under the seat?? Check the frame "ground" connection at the rear of the battery box for clean solid connection. Our SMTA needed a new bushing in that area, so I used star washers on all 3 surfaces of the connection & greased everything liberally. Grease will push out of the connection but won't let air/moisture in. No trouble in 30 years now.

Janicholson · Dec 17, 2009

A starter motor on the way out can drag its armature and be slow. If the voltage is dropping lower that 10 volts at the starter when cranking, and connections, battery, and cables are as stated, I would put a starter draw meter (cheap hold it to the wire meter)if it is in the Peg the needle category of 600 plus amps, I would rebush and rebrush the starter motor. JimN

El Toro · Dec 17, 2009

If those battery cables have crimped ends I would replace the cables with soldered ends. Clean all connections including the area where the battery is grounded. Check your battery's electrolyte using a hydrometer. Should have all battery cells in the 1.260 range. If one cell reads 1.200 or lower replace the battery. Hal

Bernie Steffen · Dec 17, 2009

Don't know how many of you fellows will read this beings as it down in the lineup but, today I made new battery cables 2-0 checked battery, loadtested it, still same results. Sooooooo pulled the starter. Found the field connection where it solderes to the bolt through the case, was loose on one field. Didn't get it all back together to try it but I think it will do better. Thanks for everything. Bernie Steffen

scot in pa · Dec 19, 2009

I got new clear battery cable at autozone or advance auto, and ran my ground up to a starter mounting bolt. I need to get the crimpid ends soldered and heat shrink over them, but it's been working good for 3 or 4 years now. I also use the marine grade dual-wall heat shrink. The inner layer is glue which melts into the connection and seals it. You can bury it in the ground and water won't seep in.

sflem849 · Dec 19, 2009

(quoted from post at 10:49:58 12/17/09) A starter motor on the way out can drag its armature and be slow...

I think Jim is on to something. Overcranking a 6 volt starter with a 12 volt battery will melt it down in a hurry. When you "redid" the tractor two years ago you should have had the starter rebuilt for 12 volts if you wanted to run a 12 volt battery. Something in the system is not up to par. My money is on the battery or starter. The battery bc you haven't done anything with it yet bc you didn't want ot flip the seat. The starter bc you are over volting it.
On a side note, what oil are you running? The crappy starter could have enough umph to turn over the motor in the summer, but not turn it over with thick oil in the winter. Just a thought.

Battery Cables

Bernie Steffen

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Andrew Z

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Bernie Steffen

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Andrew Z

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John T

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Owen Aaland

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Bernie Steffen

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CNKS

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gene bender

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Brownie 450

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Janicholson

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El Toro

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Bernie Steffen

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scot in pa

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sflem849

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