Neutral Safety switch idea.

For DavidG and those thinking of Neutral safety switches.
This will be a description of a solution I think works.
The front edge of the shifter lever bowl shaped weather protector that is spring loaded onto the tower top is a location that is usable to place a micro switch. A waterproof 20 amp roller actuated Noemally open switch positioned so that the lip of the bowl at the very front pushes the roller in when the shifter is in neutral. will work at any point left to right in neutral because the tilt moves but the edge does not. A 3/16" bracket would be sufficient to position it. When in any gear, the rim of the bowl will be either below, or above the roller, opening the contacts.
This will work on any tractor with that style of lever/tower, and an horizontal neutral.
To work on a farmall with the big push button start switch, a 3 terminal starter relay is used.
The starter relay is placed between the big button switch, and the starter's cable terminal on the starter. The S terminal on the relay is connected to the microswitch, the other microswitch terminal is connected to the starter side terminal of the Big Button Switch.
In action, the shifter is placed in N.
The micro switch is closed.
The ignition is on (or off!)
The big button is pushed. This sends voltage to the relay, and to the microswitch then to the S terminal on the relay.
The relay energizes and the starter is engauged.

If the system were used on a push or pull rod starter, the starter saddle switch would need to have an additional Micro switch placed on it to close when the rod is pushed or pulled. This microswitch would be placed in series with the shifter switch. to allow voltage to go to the added starter relay mentioned above.
This would work (start) when ever the shifter was in N and the rod was pushed or pulled.
Thus the saddle sw, and relay would both conduct, spinning the starter. Fun thinking if nothing else. Jim

Jim,

I appreciate you input, as a neutral switch is always preferable to a clutch switch. I will look at my H and see how this could work.

My tractor has a button start. I am planning to add a solenoid to reduce the amps through the button. It is hard to get good quality buttons now.

If the new relay is paralleled with the existing big Pushbutton. it would need a seperate small pushbutton in the Safety switch circuit to energize it other wise it will remain on A total replacement of the manual switch with a small push button in the N circuit will work, but removes the big button from authenticity.
There are high amp switches for old Chevrolet trucks that do hold up, but are not of the OEM design. Jim

for me its an automatic reaction to always check gear shift before starting tractor. everyone depends on saftey stuff instead of actually thinking at times. as i say at work, "you guys need saftey for your safety" cause there is just to much safety junk that is not nessesary. always seems to be the safety stuff that gives the problem and down time. safety is good though and really believe in it but it gets annoying when you have to depend on it instead of making sure the personal is qualified for the job.but that is life.

Seems to me if one pulls the belt pulley gearbox, a three position, spring-loaded, center-resting off-on-off switch with levers linked to, or bearing on, the ends of all the rails, could be installed.

Of course there are other ways using magnetic pick-up or maybe some optical sensor.

Personally, I would have to go to a Power Transmission or Automation Specialist dealer and let them shuffle through their thousands of catalogs. Or maybe it's as easy as a google search. It's also likely that such a switch might be found in an auto or truck salvage yard for handling AC controls or any number of functions in a modern vehicle. I dunno. My newest vehicle was built in 1998 and is a low optioned 1-ton Diesel.

Just dreaming, Jim, and I am not even an electronics geek. Not saying your's won't work but magnetic pickup sounds cool and there is no contact. All three rails would have to "make" before a signal could get to the starter solenoid's "S" terminal.

I thought of a magnet glued to the shifter "bowl" but magnetic reed switches are not current level devices, they usually need a relay, complicating the issue. We have several machines with oil/water proof roller actuated microswitches that are very reliable. The trans internals would require 3 ganged switches as you describe, all in modestly difficult locations unless the top was upside down on a bench.

I avoid complex solutions when possible. It is an interesting topic. Jim

There are some mag switches are fairly capable. They take a bigger magnet of course. I'm not following on how to detect the middle of three positions using a single switch monitoring a single edge?

Mechanical engineers would not use a triple switch for monitoring the rails, but would install some kind of cross bar that pushed on a single switch, cause that's how they think. They sure can kludge up some stuff.

Shooting a hole through all three rails and using a photo detector would be kinda cool providing splash oil wasn't a problem. As a feature creep idea, does it need to detect stuck rails? :lol:

You could rig one quite easily like the later ford workmasters had.

I would think that magnetic or position would be the only way to
go, optical would foul with oil.

The bowl shaped rain cover at the bottom of the external part of the shift lever (with the spring holding it down is fixed in relation to the lever. In neutral, the front center edge of the bowl is, lets say, 2.5 inches from the platform deck. As the lever is moved left to right in the Neutral gate, the heght above the deck does not change as the bowl tips right, then left. This is the location of the roller on the safety switch (when on and conducting). As the lever is moved forward into any gear slot (R,2,4 on an H), the edge moves down to 2.25 inches from the deck releasing the pressure on the roller, and shutting off the Microswitch (open). If the lever is put in any gear that pulls the lever to the rear, (1,3,5 on an H) the edge moves up to 2.75 inches above the deck and again the switch is open. Remember thes distances are to be measured, not assumed to be correct. It would work on any tractor with this bowl shaped rain deflector, provided it has a gear pattern with a single straight line neutral.
Cubs, A, B, C, 300, 400, etc. Jim