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Building up a worn shaft

I

Inno

Well-known Member
I was given (work exchange actually) a Ford YT16 yard tractor. It runs pretty well but the steering is pretty badly worn.
I have ordered some new bushings but that's only half the battle. The shafts are worn worse than the bushings are.
So here is a picture of the sector gear shaft, there is supposed to be a bushing at both ends, you can see the wear is pretty significant.
I plan to weld the low spots to build them up and then grind/sand back down to size. Any words of advice are appreciated as far as rod choice (I'm thinking 7018) and technique. Thanks
2325.jpg
 
I "think" the old welder that would do stuff like that for us used a machinable nickle rod,because it would flow evenly with very little splatter,and had good build.might check on lincolns website,they used to have info there on different projects and things.
 
If you don't get the built up spot re-machined
perfectly smooth it will eat up your new bushings
very quickly. I think I would just go with new
bushings and try it.
 
I weld a pass length wise with the shaft, turn half a turn, weld another pass, turn half, clean, and weld next to the first one, etc. etc.
 
(quoted from post at 14:56:12 08/04/11) If you don't get the built up spot re-machined
perfectly smooth it will eat up your new bushings
very quickly. I think I would just go with new
bushings and try it.
Click to expand...

The shafts are way more worn than the bushings so just replacing the bushings probably wouldn't help all that much. I am not so much worried about getting it nice and smooth as I am about making it as close to round as possible. The wear is really only on one side of the shaft (for obvious reasons).
The front wheel spindles are also in need of build up but I know those take a lot more abuse than this steering shaft does. I'm just looking for a few years of functionality around the yard with minimal investment. I'd rather replace bushings than repair shafts again. It almost seems that the bushings are a tougher material than the shafts are as the bushings hardly seem worn compared to the wear I see on the shafts. Maybe someone has replaced the bushings before I don't know.
 
(quoted from post at 14:56:40 08/04/11) I weld a pass length wise with the shaft, turn half a turn, weld another pass, turn half, clean, and weld next to the first one, etc. etc.
Click to expand...

That was kind of what I was planning on doing.
 
Well..........maybe it was an afterthought but the front wheel spindles are FULL of grease, but they're still worn out. So I guess he was selective about his lubricant.
 
(quoted from post at 16:24:35 08/04/11) SPAY WELD
Click to expand...

I found that on another site but I am trying to do this as cheap as possible. It is an old tractor that I'm just trying to breathe a little more life into, I'm not restoring it nor will I be putting a lot of time/hours on it.
 
I have it done on a lathe,if it's not perfectly round it going to bind up when you trun it and will wear out then new brushing faster than you can say steering shaft.
 
Quick, cheap and dirty. If you have a metal cutting band saw, mix some of the filings with JB Weld into a paste. Fill in the washouts and file even with the un worn shaft after it is hard. It'll last a good long while on a lawn tractor.
 
I'm assuming you don't have a lathe [otherwise you would just make oversize bushings to tighten up on the shaft]. After you weld it you will still need to spin it somehow. Then with another abrasive power tool you can sand it down. As it spins in a drill press or whatever you hit it with the sander so it removes material evenly and keeps it round. You can also make a sleeve to suround the new bushings and squeeze them onto the shaft tighter. Whatever your interference fit when pressing a bushing will also reduce the inner hole by that much or even a little more. So then you need to ream back to desired size anyway.
 
I am guessing that is the sector you are holding in your hand in the picture.

Is there any chance you can separate it from the shaft and just make a new one?

I once installed extra long bushings to correct that same problem on an Avery tractor. and although the steering is not perfect, I am still running the tractor.

I don't think I would try the JB weld idea mentioned here. I think eventually what wears off will ball up and try to bind the shaft in the bushings.
 
I"m with Dick L.. there is no need for perfection , the JB weld will work fine , and will be easy to shape....
 
JB Weld for sure on that piece. Dick hit it right on the head.
Its a steering sector in a garden tractor, not a crankshaft. JB Weld will last as long as you will even need.
Welding and doing as you are describing will only ruin the shaft.
 
"JB Weld will last as long as you will even need."

You CAN'T possibly be SERIOUS, are you?
 
An epoxy type repair might last a fairly long time. Certainly not as long as steel. I would check with a bigger industrial supply(or the internet) and see if Devcon or someone else has an epoxy designed for applications like yours. I've read great things about Belzona molecular but don't know where to buy it. Apparently it can even be used for repairing things like keyways. If you wanted to weld it, it wouldn't make a lot of difference which rod you used but you'd have to get it turned on a lathe so it was perfectly round. MIG would actually be a good choice cause it's slightly harder. You probably want to preheat the shaft a little bit, maybe 150/200 deg..
 
(quoted from post at 21:03:16 08/04/11) I am guessing that is the sector you are holding in your hand in the picture.

Is there any chance you can separate it from the shaft and just make a new one?
Click to expand...

That is probably a more worthwhile idea than anything I was thinking of. It's just 3/4" round stock........it would take some cutting and re-welding but certainly less than if I were to try and fill the low spots......probably a lot straighter and more resistant to wear too. The only special thing about it is one groove for a "c" clip but I can probably just drill it and use a washer and cotter pin. Not looking for perfection just want it to work.
 
Check the link.
I bought the smallest amount of the Belzona for a mold repair job after the Belzona tec guy came into my mold shop to tell me about the shaft and other shaft repairs. I didn't find the video that he showed me but found this on youtube.
The smalles amout I could buy cost over 300 dollars I have used it on several small jobs and it sure seems like JB Weld with metal added.
LINK
 
I think you were right to start with.7018,then take it to somebody with a lathe and get it turned back down and it will probably last a long time.JB Weld is not going to work for this.There might be something that will work for that,which is like JB Weld,but why not just weld it up and turn it down and you know it will work then.You might even rig a drill press up some way to turn it and make a bracket to hold a grinder and turn it down like that.But it would be real hard to get it very close free hand with a grinder.If you just weld it up,and then try and free hand it with a grinder,it will probably be about as bad as it is now by the time you get it where a bushing will slide over it.Lathe is the best idea.
 
JB Weld might be sufficient for the sector shaft but I would not like it's chances with the front wheel shafts.
I really need to quit posting late at night. When I answered what t.r.k. wrote I forgot that the sector shaft makes a 90° turn and the end has been made flat with a hole in it to accept a bolt which connects it to the steering arm.
 
For all of my lawn mowers I have replaced the bushings in the wheels with sealed bearings. That way metal filled JB Weld does not have any thing turning on the shaft. Costs a coupla bucks a bearing times four and you never have sloppy wheels again.

With the equipment I have welding and turning down a shaft would not be a problem but the average feller would have to end up at a machine shop and loosing a coupla dinners at the Red Lobster.
 
I just remember an add for Belzona on the back of farm equipment catalogue. I'm sure Devcon has metal filled epoxy that's a lot more reasonable.
 
(quoted from post at 10:56:00 08/05/11) For all of my lawn mowers I have replaced the bushings in the wheels with sealed bearings.
Click to expand...


That is a good idea for sure. I might have to do that. I already received the bushings I ordered but they weren't all that much. Looks like I can get sealed roller bearings (sealed one side so I can still grease them) that will fit for about $8 a piece.
 
So I think I will JB Weld the sector shaft because I think it will last a good long time based on it's intended usage. For the wheel spindles I may consider ordering some roller bearings. If I do order bearings I will use JB on that as well.
As far as having it spray welded and machined down, this machine is simply not worth enough to have it done. If I owned a small lathe I would definitely be looking at welding/machining.........someday..........someday.
Thanks for all the replies, I should have asked this question a week ago BEFORE I went and ordered bushings.
 
For a slow turning shaft like that you don't need a lathe. I have welded many shafts like that and then I fit them by hand. Just spray the shaft with black paint (or dye or blue paint from an artist supply) and fit it in the bushing. Take it back out and grind the place where the paint is rubbed off. It will take an hour or so but you can make it fit with just a few thousands clearance. I just did that with the bushings on my fifth wheel hitch on my truck.
You can also fit and oversize bushing in a worn hole the same way, but you have to use a sander instead of a grinder. I did the front swivel on the front axle on my backhoe that way. It has worked good for a number of years now.
 
I guess that is true.........another consideration for the wheel spindles is that they are only worn on the bottom so the top half of the shaft will not require any building or resizing.
Every answer I get makes me rethink my method. My gut instinct when I first started tearing it all apart was to weld to bring it up and then grind and sand to get the size correct. We'll see how the mood strikes me when I start on it, hopefully this evening. I have a neighbor who is a millwright and he will likely have a good idea for me.
 
I may even try to make a makeshift lathe to make things go a bit quicker and hopefully true it up better.
 
On a steering sector for an old garden tractor? Of course it will last. Not worth the money or time to do much more than that to a shaft that will see very little service.
 
I just revisited this post while surfing through the YT boards and had another idea. Your picture doesn't show the RH end of the shaft (if there are any special details like splines, etc.) but if there's nothing too fancy at that end simply grind off the weld at the RH end and replace the shaft. All that we can see is a snapring groove, EASILY duplicated in a new shaft.
 
Got the sector figured out. I will post pics when I have time. The bushings I bought were slightly longer than original which means that I don't have to worry about the shaft being worn. It's back together now, turns smoothly and it is nice and snug, no sloppiness and modified so I can replace the bushings very easily if I ever need to. Tomorrow I will tackle the wheel spindles. Details to follow.
 
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