seeding (grass) and fertilizing???

Hey,
few days ago, I asked about when to fertilize pastures..... They get constant horse poo that is dragged/scattered several times a season. Local guy said just nitrogen in spring and a lime/nitrogen for the areas with moss...... Another guy said use a complete fertilizer in fall......

Any of you folks do hay and pastures in fall????? Weather (and time) fits better for me but don't wanna waste bucks.... The soil sample and fertilize accordingly isn't cost effective for me (sample testing is real expensive and I have 10 or so small (1/2-1 acre) places..... Would just a universal fertilizer in fall serve the purpose, or is it money better spent just using nitrogen in spring? Also, have a couple hard used places that I won't use again til May (+/- a week or so), it don't really freeze til January, think I can broadcast and harrow some seed now and have it do any good?

Thanks, Dave

If testing is hundreds of dollars then I would just go ahead with a blend like 20-10-20. usually testing can save you a lot because fertilizer is so expensive. You want to put it on in the spring. But if weather will be good for growing for at least 4 weeks the grass will grow enough but it will germinate only if the soil is warm as in around 55 degrees so you will want to put some fertilizer on be fore seeding If the cost of testing is prohibitive I think that I would get a soil test meter that has a probe that you stick in the ground. Places like Gemplers sell them. With it you can test for pH which is really the big thing. If your soil is acidic the plants can't take up the nitrgen.

Soil test kits are available starting with a plain ph test. PH would be the most important aspect. 6.0-7.0 should do it. If your soil needs lime, use ag lime instead of garden lime. Put it on before you drag.

Dave,
I'm in the process of disking up about an acre and a half of yard. The best results I've gotten was 3 years ago. I seeded on December 1 and it snowed on December 3. The grass didn't germinate until the next spring, but the spring rains and the cooler weather was perfect. This section of the yard made it throught our dry summer. Plan to snow seed this year.
George

I would not apply N in the fall. I do think additional P&K would help.

You wouldn't add oil to your tractor or truck without checking the dipstick first. Same thing with your soil. Take a soil test as it will always save you money by buying only what you need for that particular crop. Too high a PH can reduce the effectiveness of fertilizer and reduce yields also. Joe

I would imagine your climate/growing season is pretty similar to ours here in PA. I hear pretty regularly around here that the best time to seed grasses here is the day of the first snow. Don"t have much first hand experience, but have successfully sown small areas here pretty much any time from spring to fall, but need to water during the summer.

Good Luck,

Kirk

How much is a soil test there?

I can have one done in Oklahoma for $10 throught the County Extension.

You won't know the answer to your fertilizer need until you have results from a soil analysis.

(quoted from post at 07:42:59 10/12/12) How much is a soil test there?

I can have one done in Oklahoma for $10 throught the County Extension.

You won't know the answer to your fertilizer need until you have results from a soil analysis.

Click to expand...

So far, all I could find on the net was about 60 dollars per for a private joe that ain't on the take........

"Pastures" as such, usually don't require much fertilizer as up to 90% of P&K nutrients are returned back to the soil via the manure. There have been many studies done on pasture nitrogen fertilization spring vs fall. "Usually", fall application is best as you get better absorption and utilization over a longer period. NOrmally the "spring flush" overproduces and can't be effectively utilized. Fall application spreads out the usage period. Dave, probably the most important aspect for you would be PH adjustments if needed. I assume you rent many of your small pastures so the landowner "should" withstand part of this cost as it is a long term soil amendment. Low ph soils just do not respond to nitrogen fertilizer effectively. Convincing the land owners to do this will require some of your best "people skills". You might consider combining 2 or 3 small plots into one soil test sample if cost is a consideration. Unless you find some extremely low ph values, I'm thinking that 40 units of nitrogen fall applied will accomplish what you want. Keep us posted on what your soil tests find.

My COOP does it for free if you buy the fertilizer from them.

(quoted from post at 08:13:58 10/12/12) "Pastures" as such, usually don't require much fertilizer as up to 90% of P&K nutrients are returned back to the soil via the manure. There have been many studies done on pasture nitrogen fertilization spring vs fall. "Usually", fall application is best as you get better absorption and utilization over a longer period. NOrmally the "spring flush" overproduces and can't be effectively utilized. Fall application spreads out the usage period. Dave, probably the most important aspect for you would be PH adjustments if needed. I assume you rent many of your small pastures so the landowner "should" withstand part of this cost as it is a long term soil amendment. Low ph soils just do not respond to nitrogen fertilizer effectively. Convincing the land owners to do this will require some of your best "people skills". You might consider combining 2 or 3 small plots into one soil test sample if cost is a consideration. Unless you find some extremely low ph values, I'm thinking that 40 units of nitrogen fall applied will accomplish what you want. Keep us posted on what your soil tests find.

Click to expand...

OK..... Break it down for a dumb guy.... All the folks that I have the pastures from care about is the grass being kept down so they can collect apples in fall and not have folks complaining that they need to mow..... Getting them to pay to increase that growth won't be happening......
They have plenty of manure scattered as said and we keep the weeds (mostly nettle) under control. What about the PH and what does 40 units translate to?

Thanks

Mail your soil sample to SUSD. $10.00 per bag.

"PH", is a numerical figure used to describe the relative acidity or alkalinity of a particular soil. A ph of 6.5-7.0 is considered "neutral" as it provides the best median for nutrient "movement" and for them to hook onto the soil particles. Any reading on a soil test that is below 6.00 is telling you you have an acid soil and it needs lime. A reading between 6.0-6.5 tells you that the soil is OK for now, but will be needing lime soon.
"Units" of fertilizer refer to the actual pounds of a particular nutrient applied to a field. For example, for the most part, nitrogen for pastures is supplied (generally) with either ammonium nitrate or urea. Ammoniun nitrate typically contains 34% actual product that is utilized by the plant. In every 100 pounds of product you get 34 pounds (units)of actual nitrogen. The other 66 pounds is filler that is necessary to "carry" the actual nitrogen. If you needed 40 actual pounds (units) of nitrogen per acre and you were using ammonium nitrate, then you would put on 118 pounds of total product. (118x34%=40.12 pounds of actual nitrogen) There are other nitrogen sources so make sure you know which product you are using, as the percentage of actual nitrogen will vary.

Dave,
A 40 year sod farmer says hit it with Nitrogen. Grass like it. When he would hydro-seed, he would fill the tank with lots of nitrogen.

If you get a soil sample, it may take weeks for results. Sample only tells you what's happening in one spot, which may be where the horse crapped.

You will need many samples for an accurate evaluation.

I would plant the seeds and worry about the lime and fertilizer after many sample results come in. Or find a DIY kit and do it yourself, which will still take time to do.
George

Soil sample should not come from one spot. You should take plugs from surface down 6 inches in numerous places around the area to be tested. Mix the samples and send a portion of the mix in to be tested.

Directions are from TX A&M soil/forage testing lab.