Low price batteries (again)

The question was asked yesterday about a source for low price batteries for our older tractors.

I have been using Walmart short-warranty batteries for years. GREAT value I have yet to see any store in my area come close to this deal (northern Michigan).

I have compared these batteries side by side. I have weighed them. I have load-tested them. NO difference I can find with low price versus higher price models except for warranty.

I just checked the type 26 battery in my John Deere diesel backhoe and it is 6 years old. I just load-tested it and it checks exactly the same as a brand new one I just got for my Ford Jubilee.

I find claims of "cold cranking amps" to be kind of meaningless. I wish all batteries were rated in amp-hours or reserve-capacity which has more meaning in the real world. Especially in old tractors that often have small low compression engines with low cranking amp demands.

I have yet to find a battery warranty worth the price I have to pay for it. I wonder why some other companies don't try selling batteries minus the expensive long "sort of" warranties?

I checked actual starter motor amp draw at 50 degrees F today. 300B John Deere diesel backhoe. It cranks at 210 amps @ 9.8 volts. Obviously if it was zero degrees outside the amps would be higher. Not an issue for many of us. The Walmart type 26 battery I paid less then $50 for six years ago? Puts out 300 amps at over 11 volts for at least 15 seconds. I cannot test any longer then that because my load-tester overheats and shuts itself off. Much more then enough for my diesel tractor.

I guess if I had a diesel log skidder sitting in the woods with no block heater that I had to start at below zero F temps? Yes, then I think I'd want to find the highest rated batteries I could squeeze in. But for many if not most of us with old farm tractors?

I also test the amp draw on my 134 cube gas engine Ford Jubilee. With a 12 volt battery (6 volt start) it cranks at a steady 160 amps @ 10 volts. Again, the cheap Walmart $49 battery is more then enough.

So here are some actual tests. High science? No. Good enough to give some real-world facts though.

All of the recent talk about cheap batteries reminded me of an incident around 1990 when I was a Ford Service Manager.

A local farmer had an F-250 diesel pickup in the shop for something or other. The tech that worked on it told me the batteries were getting weak, although that was not part of the current problem.

I passed this along to the farmer and quoted him a price on a pair of Ford batteries. (Duromax?) The farmer declined, saying he could get batteries a lot cheaper somewhere else.

Several months later, the farmer came back to buy a pair of Ford batteries--and a new $300 starter.

And here is my Story. I have a 1994 Ford turbo-diesel 7.3. I just took out the Walmart batteries that were 8 years old and still fine. I just did not want to drive to far places with 8 year old batteries.

And my so-called Ford OEM starter? The original from Ford was a Japanese Hitachi. It lasted to 200,000 miles. When it finally gave me trouble, I bought a Chinese clone for $120 and it has been fine ever since.

I assume you know that Ford does not make batteries or starter motors.

Ford "Motorcraft" batteries as well as Interstate are made by Johnson Controls. Same company that supplies Walmart with their batteries.

A dude not far from me sells 2nds for about 1/2 of new price with a 30 day warranty. I go there sometimes. gm

I was soured on battery warranty a few years back. I had a 95 Ford w/7.3. I had put in house brand batteries from the local auto parts place. After a year they went south. I think they were 48 mo free replacement. It winter, wife is out of town, pickup wont start. So I plug in the semi. Get it started, head into town with the junk batteries. Kid at the counter tells me it will be a couple hours as they have to have a failed report from the computerized battery tester before they can replace under warranty.
Go back to the farm, return to the parts store 2 hours later... kid at the counter tells me, the first battery failed, it will be another 2 hours before the next one is tested!
Batteries are expensive, but I wasted a whole day screwing with free replacement. Anymore, most things just give me a discount and let's throw the warranty in the trash.

(quoted from post at 12:59:19 05/18/19) I was soured on battery warranty a few years back. I had a 95 Ford w/7.3. I had put in house brand batteries from the local auto parts place. After a year they went south. I think they were 48 mo free replacement. It winter, wife is out of town, pickup wont start. So I plug in the semi. Get it started, head into town with the junk batteries. Kid at the counter tells me it will be a couple hours as they have to have a failed report from the computerized battery tester before they can replace under warranty.
Go back to the farm, return to the parts store 2 hours later... kid at the counter tells me, the first battery failed, it will be another 2 hours before the next one is tested!
Batteries are expensive, but I wasted a whole day screwing with free replacement. Anymore, most things just give me a discount and let's throw the warranty in the trash.

Click to expand...

Looking from the other side of the counter, how can they give you warranty without unthawing the batteries, and fully charging them for testing?

I'm gonna say it again, when some of you guys install battery disconnect switches or "battery maintainers" your battery "failures" will drop to near zero.

Many newer vehicles will kill a battery when parked and not started after just 30 days. So yes, if a vehicle is not driven constantly, it
needs the battery unhooked or a maintainer. Not so much of an issue if the auto is old enough to NOT have constant draws like an alarm,
ECM memories, etc. Even my 1998 Dodge Grand Caravan will kill a full charge battery in one month. It even gives the warning in the owner's
manual.

Unhooking a battery can be kind of a pain in some areas when it causes errors in the emissions controls system. Maintainer makes things
easier. Well - except when I had not driven a car in two months and then drove off with the battery-maintainer still plugged in.

Many new cars and trucks leave the factory with a built-in 100 milliamp draw on the battery, all the time. A typical car battery is around
60-70 amp-hours. The math to calculate is not pure linear, but . . 1 amp for 70 hours is dead in 3 days. So at 100 milliamps - just a
guess with simple math - it takes 30 days.

Old tractors should not have any built-in draw. Regardless, batteries all have a self-discharge rate and that rate gets higher as
batteries age.

I have a maintainer on the battery in my 1985 diesel Isuzu truck. Battery is 14 years old. When it was new - it could sit for a year and
still start right up. Now? If I take the maintainer off, it goes dead in one day. Seems good batteries die very slow deaths and just
self-discharge beyond a tolerable point. Since my Isuzu is just a "yard buggy" that rarely gets used - I am fine with the battery until it
goes dead in less then a day.

I have the same HF load tester and usually just hook across the battery terminals, crank up the load knob to get a reading of battery amps or cca, how did you check the starter amps draw? did you hook the load tester in series with the positive lead and battery?

As I posted before as a used tractor dealer, farmer, and 49 year RV owner I've had to buy more batteries then most. I cant say I've had any worse luck with Walmart then any other brands and there's only a few companies that even make them just different labels lol

Asking what battery is best is about like which oil or spark plugs are best, you will get a ton of different opinions each swearing one or the other is best. Wouldn't it be a boring world if we all had the same preferences lol

My motto is shop and compare, be an informed purchaser and buy what's best for you, NOT one that's best for someone else. Some of the best quality and lowest price batteries I used were from a local mom n pop shop, many were "blemished".

I have no problem shopping Walmart myself but that don't stop me from checking farm supply stores or Menards etc for the best battery at the best price...??.

Shop and compare is the thing to do

John T

Having had to have all sorts of tractors or combines and cars n trucks scattered all over no tellin where, I agree battery disconnects and tenders are good to have and pay for themselves in having to buy more batteries more often lol

John T

Goose, thanks for sharing, Ive heard those kind stories before for darn sure. As some say, Pay me now or pay me later.

John T

One thing I've learned in all my yrs. (many)....cheapest is not always the least expensive.

Yes and that goes along with paying more does not always get you more.

Hook it up like you do, then run the starter & watch how low the voltage goes. Then turn the knob to read the same voltage & look at how many amps. Simple.

I heard that saying as "Pay me now or pay me MORE later."

Ive seen that hold true manyyyyyyyyyyy times. Been there done that n got the T Shirt lol. As they say 'Pay me now or pay me later"

John T Speaking from experience

EVEN BETTER LOL

John T

So did the cheap batteries ruin the starter?

JD, thanks for the thoughts. I pretty much gave up on warranties when I took a failed battery in to Wally World and with it's sticker still proudly saying something to the effect of "5 year replacement guarantee" was told I would get a prorated return of $12 or 15. So I paid an extra $30 some bucks ( at that time) for $15? Why bother!