Judge: Neighbor can take property

Just some good reading.
Whos Land?

Unbelievable.....................

I have been told there are some "homestead" laws on the books, like in Oklahoma you can claim up to 160 acres and if it is not disputed within a certain time frame it is yours free and clear. Never saw it happen but been told that....

I dont think it'll work with fed or state property

(quoted from post at 07:32:22 07/05/09) I dont think it'll work with fed or state property

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If you look at it honest........It's ALL government land, the only question is who gets to pay the taxes on which piece...... :roll:

And our government wonders why we as people are cautious to be a good neighbor?

It would seem who paid the taxes should be of some concern.

Thanks for posting this type of stuff, otherwise I would not so much as to dream of it's stupidity.

I have always said if a judge should get in a (stiff form) because some one lost control=== Well let's just say I hope I can be on the jury when the killer has his justice in the court room.

I had a neighbor who was using a piece of my land when I lived in southern Oregon. I put up a fence and told him to stay on his side. He threatened to use the Adverse law to get it but Oregon's law states that neither party must know that the land does not belong to the claimer for 20 years. In other words a wrong survey or such that neither party knows is wrong. Just using the land knowing its not yours means nothing.
Walt
PS when is some smart Lawyer going to get our land back that the counties and cities have taken without due compensation for roads and sidewalks.
That should be one of the largest lawsuits ever. All county roads out here are on private land.

Its usually called squatters rights.Its been the law since forever. Has a lot of requirements in different places. In spite of how it appears, it has it purpose. When I saw it, it was because a fence was in the wrong place, BUT BOTH PARTIES KNEW IT. When one went to change it, other party said "don't think so".
So learn. Don't let some one use your land for years with out stopping them.

As an Attorney here in Indiana I can tell you the Common Law Doctrine of "Adverse Posession" is indeed alive and well. HOWEVER it can be quite complex and hard for any lay person to understand it, Ive studied it as an attorney and its still difficult although it remains a viable cause of action. The basic requirements here are that if another person encroaches upon and uses the land of anothers for a certain statutory period he can indeed bring action and be awarded ownership of the same, the use must basically be HOSTILE,,,,,,,,OPEN,,,,,,,CONTINUOUS,,,,,,,EXCLUSIVE,,,,,,,,,,,ADVERSE,,,,,,,,NOTORIOUS among other things

The law is NOT SO MUCH TO AWARD A TRESPASSER, BUT TO PUNISH A LAND OWNER WHO SITS BY AND DOESNT BRING ACTION OVER A LONG PERIOD OF TIME. The law looks at it like,, hey if you have a problem come to us for a solution DO NOT SIT THERE FOR 10 YEARS ON YOUR DUFF because then we take the side of the trespasser.

I AM NOT ARGUING IN FAVOR OF OR AGAINST THE DOCTRINE so dont gripe at me lol Im just trying to explain it BUT CANT EXPLAIN IN A PARAGRAPH WHAT TAKES BOOKS N BOOKS TO COVER.

If you have a true problem in the area consult a local real estate attorney NOT any lay person here on a tractor forum because theres too much at risk to trust some bar buddy or your brother in law lol

God Bless yall n remain diligent regarding trespassers ya hear !!!!!!!!!!!

John T Country Lawyer in Indiana

Walt. Our farm was in the Camp Adair contonement and the neighbors wasn't. When my parents bought the farm, the right of way that was the old wagon road to the coast. (now Fishback Rd) had been vacated. When they went to sell in 1980 the neighbor said the ROW was his and the shop my Dad had built in the 60's was on his land. The neighbor threatened to sue but the county said the ROW was vacated 1/2 and 1/2....James

If the Bakers purchased this property back in 2003, shouldn't these issues have been questioned back then.... Title insurance, steel survey pins on each corner of the property, and a staked off property border could have helped...?? Wonder also, were the previous owners of the Baker property, as well as the Bakers themselves, taking a "free ride" by having the Hammonds do the maintenance and upkeep on the property all these years..... reguardless, this deal really stinks... Takes some real nerve to construct anything on someone else's property...

I think we ought to just give it all back to the indians. Then the govenment will collapse cause there will be no income coming in.

There will be no taxes, and us guys can just hunt and fish, and set around smoking pipes each evening around the campfire while we wait for the squaws to make supper.

What a deal.

Gene

I had heard that NY changed the laws on this, well apparently that is not true.

I have a similar problem with a neighbor who has done the same thing, but much worse, by use, installing new grass/lawn, cutting same, horseshoe pit, fire pit, letting their kids ride atv's and parking vehicles. In short, I have been on the guys case every year about it, last year I told him to cease all of it, had been close to 10 years, the place was posted for 24 years, he always said he would not do that, (adverse possession) and his wife had a real attitude of entitlement and use of our land, a farm dating back to the turn of the century, now an empty lot, adjacent to their home.

Last week I attempted to evict them, 1 year ago, I told the guy, all of this stops now, this year he starts mowing 50 feet into our side, fills the lot with cars and has building materials stored, landscaping appurtenances over the line, etc. etc.

When I tried to evict them I was threatened by one of the occupants, that was the last straw, I stood my ground, things got real nasty, I was arrested for attempting to evict them. Law enforcement took their side.


I have a survey map, all kinds of photos and other legal documentation including the neighbors deed, photos before they occupied, clear and definitive delineation of the 2 adjacent properties exists. These people would enter this property at will and do as they wish. At this time the surveyor re-established the line, a stockade fence was immediately erected while he was still on site, I have an atty and will take it to trial.

Law enforcement is an absolute joke when it comes to a matter like this, both NYS Police and the Sheriff. You don't want them involved, these matters are civil and they hate dealing with it. No insult intended to any cops out there, based on my experience here, it's an absolute joke, you have no right to evict people, vehicles and stop intruders, even when it is clearly posted.

One thing is for sure, the atty that helped these people win is ethically and completely wrong, I don't care what the law says. The judge is wrong, if that were to happen here, given the documentation and legal documents, it would make the national news, people that take land using the basis of adverse possession are bottom feeding thieves, the atty should be disbarred. If they took that much of our lot, the real estate investment would be harmed and it's value reduced dramatically, yet the neighbors, in our absence, continued with their use of our property, it could have lead to them making a claim, I firmly stand my ground, and that law and or laws in this state needs to be completely abolished, it allows people to steal without it being a crime.

Billy, youre doing the RIGHT thing and best wishes with it, I hope you win.. Youre also doing what the law prefers in that you are takign action AND NOT SITTING THERE FOR THE STATUTORY PERIOD after which the law could favor the wrongdoer. The law WANTS YOU TO TAKE ACTION NOT SIT ON YOUR RIGHTS so having good evidence and pictures and deeds and surveys and other data will sure help your attorney. Same here, call the cops about something like this and they cant do much. In some states you can get triple damages regarding trespass violations with resultant damages where its clear and posted so good luck... Perhaps you can get injunctions and restraining orders etc in which case then the cops can help a lot more if n when it happens again as that takes it out of civil to more criminal matters woooooo hoooooooo lol

John T Country Lawyer

Okay, so some people from NY take care of a strip of land that they dont own and now....They are entitled to it.

But-----What happens if the original land owner wrecks the land by cutting down a tree, flattening a tire or 2, (you know being a real *ickhead about it) CAUSE THAT IS WHAT I WOULD DO.

If one of my neighbors decided to cut the grass for 10 or 20 years cause they didnt like it then tough crap, I still own it and then he decides that he now owns a piece of MY land then tough crap, you now made a real pi$$ed off neighbor who is going to F- you over so bad that you will wish that you were never born. I would likely go so far as to set him up for a felony, like DUI or something.
I have a former coworker that is on a city lot--80 x 200 deep and the back 20 feet of his lot is a mulch/compost area and the guy behind his land made a comment years ago that my coworker friend should plant trees and shrubs back there. Well my friend says, no I am not doing that, a month later he goes back behind his garage and there are flowers and shrubs planted there. My buddy ripped all of it up and burned it just to make a point.
Moral of the story--stand up for yourself, neighbors can be a$$holes and be ready for a fight if needed.

You know, you just might have something there, Gene. Perhaps we could work it out in Missouri and lead the rest of the nation in this! :>)

Christopher

Billy, If all that stuff is on "your" land, it must be yours right?

What is stopping you from selling it? (just an idea)

Maybe put FOR SALE signs all over with your phone number on it to
get the point across.

John T, I have always appreciated you sharing your knowledge on the law and electricity. I thank you as I am sure others do also. Perhaps you can provide some legal insite to my situation. 7 years ago I bought a farm that had been in the same family since 1899. In 1905 the original owner deeded 8 acres for a church to be built. That church was disbanded in 1972 and the building burned down in 1977. I keep the ditches mowed, and when I don't the county charges me to mow them. I am not concerned about the surface rights, but I would like the mineral rights (100%)that were granted to the church. In case it matters this is in ND on the edge of the Baaken formation, the nearest producing oil well is 2 1/2 miles away. When I asked my own country lawyer he rolled his eyes back in his head and told me to become a minister and start to hold services out there in a tent. So, that is my question, is it posssible to get those mineral rights.

cjk,

In KY that will get you in some hot water. I got into this with my exwife. She left her car setting in my drive way and dared me to move it. It was titled in her name. I was going to haul it to the river port and have it crushed or sell it for parts. Luckly I asked my lawyer first. In KY I can park a car in your yard and you can not do a flip'n thing to it. You CAN call a wrecker and have it towed off as an abandoned car. Your beer drink'n buddy who has a body shop can haul it off and take time in finding a name and adress to find out who owns it from the tags, then bill the owners for haul'n and storage. After 30 days if they don't come and get it, wrecker service can file a mechanics lein on it, go to court and get a clear title and do with it as they please. It is a round about way of doing the same thing but (here at least) you have to cover your rear and do it right.

Dave

How would the courts rule if papers of said property showed up as to whom payed the taxes for all those years?

I see nothing wrong in this. Very simply you can not stand by and watch someone else use your land without a complaint from you for a long period of time.
If I start using a piece of your land all you need to to is tell me to quit, send me a certified letter or call the law on me. There you have just covered your as. No judge would take your land now.
The law is not a secret, if I am vaugly aware of it, I"m sure that most other folks are also.
Neihgbor had a culvert wash out, and I told him he could accsess his field through my corner. Although we a good neighbors I had him sign an agreement stating that access was on a temporary basis only and his use conveyed no rights or priviledges to him and that I could revoke access at anytime without notice.
It ain"t rocket science people just be proactive and nip trangressions in the bud.

The wording on the deed you mentioned is very critical........ If it was specifically for a church use (Deeded to so n so provided or for so long as a church is there etc etc) and such no longer exists, theres a good chance the land reverts back to the owner or his successors in title and an action to quiet title would be relatively easy. However if it was just a deed that just happened to be to the Church of Billy Bob its much harder for the owner to ever get it back absent adverse posession. Regardless, it would take an action to quiet title and such requires some good evidence and history etc and wont be cheap even if from a country lawyer. In the meantime I would openly exercise control and dominion over the property by mowing and maintaining it just as if it were your own and keep good records and a diary which will help someday in an adverse posession action. This assumes it was sold fee simple ie including mineral rights ie they were NOT retained by the Grantor in the deed

John T

Payment of taxes is actually one of the other "requirements" in my list above for adverse posession but its NOT one of the more strict and there are run arounds that. Trouble is the adverse posessor is NOT the record title holder so why would the government ever send him the tax bills??? Thats one reason that rule isnt that strong, however if the adverse posessor somehow got the bills n paid them through the years that sure helps his case. Usually if one abandons property he quits paying taxes anyway. In the original posters question it sure sounds like the trespasser wasnt paying any taxes so that helps the poster, ie the owner NOT the trespasser.

John T

Geez James just where on Fishback rd. was the farm. My address is 14125 Fishback Rd. My farm is the Old Cooper Home at the bottom of the hill. Cooper Hollow rd is the west side of the property.
Walt
PS give me a call at (503) 623-0460

I think we're covered John, I've been on this guys case enough about it, last year I said no more, this year they go behind my back, think I don't notice or test me until I show up, which I did. I live up on a hill behind them, not like I'm not aware of what they do.

The story about the adverse possessor winning the 35'x175' of land, is a prime example of legal theft, I thought the laws on it in NY were to be changed. There is a serious concern about the potential of this when people step over the line and do things on your land, hence my actions last week, cannot afford to have it happen, and they don't want to consider what would happen if they tried to take 1" of the place, law or no law.

I will look into any potential damages, having been charged with menacing over this, threatened by one of them, a trespasser, legal expense, surveyor expense and fence installation expense, no need for any of it, but some people just can't leave things alone, they have to be a nuisance.

It's gone now, I peeled up the horseshoe pits 1 year ago, using my loader, and dumped same on there property. When he saw the surveyor install pins, and the fence going up, he started scrambling to remove everything in the way, I rather enjoyed that, and the frantic cell phone conversations to get help to do so. Nice to have closure on this part of it, though the courtroom awaits.

That's interesting, I see another car parked in my lot, the D7 Caterpillar will awake from it's nap and head towards the car, law or no law, it will end up off the property onto the state road, no extra charge!

That's what I meant that the owner would be paying the taxes so my thoughts would be even if the owner wasn't using the land it would still be his to do with as how seemed fit and trespasser would be subject to all applicable laws and penalties .

As it is now the trespasser, If he got hurt on owners land could sue the owner if he was a ^$%^*%# and end up owning the land anyway.

Great ideas, I thank you much.