Gonna get in trouble over this one...

Anonymous-0 · Sep 11, 2009

Gonna have Allan kick me for this one, but I have to ask.
Normally I see nothing but red in the barn, but I had a chance to pick up a green one like my great uncle had. Best as I can tell it is a 53 model 50. Not bad, not good, but it runs. Figured I would use it for hayrides for the kids at church.
Problem is, when it's cold...it is really hard to start. Cranks good, just does not fire up. It will eventually start...but has to be hard on the battery. Pull it 10 feet and it pops right off.
Had an old man tell me to put it in neutral and engage the clutch. He said the clutch will drag it down when cranking dis-engaged.
I really do not want to engage the clutch for fear it will pop in gear or something.
Anyone have any ideas? I know it needs a carb overhaul. I have already put plugs, and a tune up kit in it.
Thanks in advance.

pete black · Sep 11, 2009

the old man is right, although it may mainly apply to 6 volt systems. in some manuals of my pertaining to my old chevy truck it states "cranking the truck in neutral is preferred", and then it mentions it lessens the load on the starter/battery.

El Toro · Sep 11, 2009

If you have a mag the impulse coupling may not be snapping that provides a hotter spark. Hal

Anonymous-0 · Sep 11, 2009

No mag...

Anonymous-0 · Sep 11, 2009

Perhaps an electronic ignition would fix it up. The 50 series of tractors seem to be very popular.

Ultradog MN · Sep 11, 2009

That tractor fits well into any collection.
My brother has one. Uses it for everything.
I was born in 53 and though I'm a Ford man I'd much rather have a 50 than a Jubilee.

Animal · Sep 11, 2009

If this tractor has the stock fuel shut off it takes oil pressure to turn on the fuel, I crank mine a few seconds then stop then crank again, this lets the fuel go to the carb, then it fires.

buickanddeere · Sep 11, 2009

Must be something wrong. Either of the 50's at home fire off cold on the 1st turn.
Is there fuel in the carb bowl? What is the voltage across the coil when cranking? Is the battery wired + or - to chassis? Is the coil wired + or - to chassis? Is the battery chassis return cable bolted to the battery box or cast iron?

Janicholson · Sep 11, 2009

When it is cold out, put a volt meter on the starter motor terminal, and a ground near by. Check the crank volts at the starter. If it is 6v the starter should see 5.8 volts or more. If 12v the starter should see 11v when cranking. If the battery is sound, and voltage is good, a weak coil might be the cause. If the voltage is low compared to the above, I would look to putting 00gauge bat cables, including ground, on it. JimN

jbp · Sep 11, 2009

Have a 60. I always disengage the clutch as otherwise you are draging the first reduction and transmission gears while starting. 90 weight oil gets mighty stiff in cold weather and creates a lot of drag on the starter. My 2 cents.
Joe

Anonymous-0 · Sep 11, 2009

It is 12V Pos GND. You bring up a good point on the coil...did not even look at it. I almost know it needs a carb and there is no fuel shut off...I turn it off at the bowl by hand. I have seen this new gas turn to water if it sets too long.
So far all I have done to it is put 4 new tires and rims on it...long way to go.

Anonymous-0 · Sep 11, 2009

Don't know where that Blewitt name came from...wow! But it was my response...how odd.

Allan in NE · Sep 11, 2009

Bill,

It can't be fixed so I suggest ya give it to me. Spent my far-away youth on those things. :>)

If it pops right off by pulling, then it sounds like you're losing ignition voltage while the starter is running.

Batteries, starter drag, or that rat's nest of battery cables/clamps under the seat.

Allan

Paul from MN · Sep 11, 2009

I've seen similar problems. Could be bad coil. Or you'd be suprised how often someone puts resistor plug wires on. It will run, but starting will be difficult... Check the wires and if necessary replace with copper plug wires.

I picked up an A for next to nothing. The owner had tried everything and could not get it to start or run right. Brought it home, replaced the wires, and it is the easiest most reliable starting, hand start tractor I have.

Anonymous-0 · Sep 11, 2009

Even at 12 volts battery cables and their connections are critical to good starting. Dirty connections make for poor starting. That voltage check at the starter terminal is a good test. Watch out for battery cables from the wallyworld battery kiosk that are good for a 1 litre nippon car, not a tractor engine. 2 gauge cables are about right at 12 volts, not 6 gauge.

Copper plug wires are important. And getting fuel past the oil pressure shut off (which often fails draining the gas tank into the crankcase) is a benefit.

Later new generation JD gas tractors ran a 6 volt coil with a dropping resistor and an auxiliary contact on the starter solenoid applies battery voltage direct to the coil for better starting.

An ordinary 12 auxiliary lighting cube relay ($3.95 at a car parts store) with its coil wired in parallel with the starter solenoid coil and its contacts wired to short the starting resistor will do the same thing for not much money beyond the 6 volt coil.

Gerald J.

bill mart · Sep 11, 2009

I thought the wire core plug wires were only needed for mags,do the make a difference on distributors too?

Fixer · Sep 11, 2009

Bill 46 I would try a jumper wire from Negative side of battery(if positive ground_) to coil. Sounds like not getting enough voltage. That jumper is just to try to see if it makes any difference Bernie Steffen

Anonymous-0 · Sep 11, 2009

I think so. And they last longer without being supported. My gas 4020 came with carbon wires, the wire from the coil to the distributor was so bad it would kill the engine if I moved it just right and on the road it made the tractor buck in 8th gear at full throttle. I put copper wires with soldered ends on it and its not needed any ignition service in the decade since.

Gerald J.

John B. · Sep 11, 2009

Carbon plug wires can be damaged just by pulling on them. I put copper plug wires on all my old gas tractors.

My uncle rebuilt magnetos for years and still has the test bench and you ought to see how badly carbon wires work on magnetos. You're lucky to get a spark to jump. I'm not sure what the difference is and I never asked him either. But I seen it with my own eyes.

flying belgian · Sep 11, 2009

We had a 50 and left the spreader hooked to it all winter. (Minnesota winter) It sat nose first in an open front shed and we hauled manure every Sat. That thing would start every time even if 20 below zero. You should not have to go 10 feet when you pull start it. It should start in the distance it takes to roll the engine over once. Maybe 3 feet. I'm going to stray from the herd on this one. I wonder if you have poor compression. Maybe rings or valves. What do the rest of you think?

John B. · Sep 12, 2009

Yes I was thinking compression my self.

wolfman · Sep 13, 2009

If it has the standard fuel shut-off that takes oil pressure to open, try holding down on the little plate above the sediment bowl for a few seconds before cranking it. My 60 needs this if it sits a week or longer. The 520 doesn't have room for my fat fingers between the bowl & tank, so I use a small screwdriver.

Anonymous-0 · Sep 14, 2009

It does not have a fuel shutoff other than the one on the sediment bowl. No oil pressure set up.
Guess I will change the wires and see if a by pass wire to the coil helps.
Might run a compression check...might throw a set of rings and do a valve job on it this winter.
Thanks for the help.

Gonna get in trouble over this one...

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