block heaters

Erik Ks farmer · Jan 13, 2013

I put an ad out yesterday to sell some extra hay I had on hand, of course this morning it was 9 degrees when the calls started coming in. The hay I wanted to sell is at home but my skid loader and loader tractor that I feed with were at another farm. Not wanting to move the open loader tractor I fought the skid loader to get it started. I can not understand why manufacturers sent diesel equipment to the mid west without factory installed block heaters. Just seems like common sense to me.

old popper · Jan 13, 2013

They do that of course so you can practice your four letter vocabulary. It's our own fault for living in this frozen wonderland. Wouldn't have it any other way.

notjustair · Jan 13, 2013

Same reason my loader tractor is gas. What a pain.

Neighbor was needing to move bales. She didn't have her skid steer or her loader tractor plugged in. We had to wait while one warmed up enough to start. It was just easier to drive my tractor over there. I will always keep a good old gas tractor around here as a backup. If the power goes out here I have to make sure to get the generator started before it cools off or we do without power.

JayinNY · Jan 13, 2013

I think there optional on some equipment. Why give you
something, when they can charge you for it! Lol,,If you don't
want to install a block heater, you could try a lower radiator
hose heater. I put one on my ford tractor and it works pretty
good. I never had any problems with it.

Kow Farmer · Jan 13, 2013

Erik,
Funny you should mention this issue. I just installed a new block heater in my Gehl skid loader last Thursday night. The original was shot and I have owned the machine for over 3 years now. So, after my water pump went out, I decided to finally replace the block heater too. Well I tell you what. When the block heater was installed on my skid loader it was probably done when the engine was out on its stand. Because the new one was dang near impossible to get too because the way the frame work is built on my machine. After some ingenuity I got the heater replaced. Not fun by any means. Good luck with yours. They can be a pain to install, but sure do help up here in the northern climate.
Kow Farmer (Kurt)

pete 23 · Jan 13, 2013

It took a long time before factory offered a block
heater as optional equipment on a new rig. Do you
know what a pain it is to take one out of a new skid
loader when the customer says he won't take it with
it in there. Boss sure isn't going to lose a sale
just because mechanic has to do a little extra work
getting a machine ready for delivery. No two
customers alike I will tell you.

oldtanker · Jan 13, 2013

Got a lot of landscape companies here in the "heart of the lakes" area in west MN. Some do snow plowing in the winter but a lot just don't run thier skid steers when it's cold. A small business can't be paying for stuff that isn't needed and be sucessful. So block heaters are an option. Right now we are ar +3F. a diesel without a block heater is not going to start real easy.

Rick

BushogPapa · Jan 13, 2013

If it is Cold enough for a Block Heater, it is Cold enough for a Heated Battery Blanket...

Batteries at 0* will ONLY give an output equal to a 50% Charged Battery that would test Fully Charged at 70*...
And NO, you cannot "Fully Charge" a battery that is 0*....
Block Heaters are Great..even the Magnetic type, to warm the oil-Pan...

Ron..

buickanddeere · Jan 13, 2013

(quoted from post at 15:57:40 01/13/13) Got a lot of landscape companies here in the "heart of the lakes" area in west MN. Some do snow plowing in the winter but a lot just don't run thier skid steers when it's cold. A small business can't be paying for stuff that isn't needed and be sucessful. So block heaters are an option. Right now we are ar +3F. a diesel without a block heater is not going to start real easy.

Rick

For the measly cost of a block heater. It is a great money saving and productivity boosting investment. In particular with hired help running the equipment. Penny wise and pound foolish not to option the heater.

nickg · Jan 13, 2013

Ya its funny how that works.For whatever reason construction equipment never seems to have block heaters. Or at least all the backhoes,excavators and dozers I have ever run never have them unless you put them in. Guess they figure your not gonna be using it in the winter months or have anywhere to plug it in. Of coarse I love the guys who like to brag about not plugging there trucks or tractors in and say they always start. Ya I bet they do after you crank and crank and kill your batteries and starter not to mention how hard it is on an engine that needs heat to run efficiently.I dont know about you but Im pretty sure all that knocking and hammering cant be good on it. I just had to replace my block heater on my cummins. Boy what a pain that was, not to mention it failed when we were getting down in the teens at night.

JayinNY · Jan 13, 2013

I can just imagine what a nightmare that jib must be on a skidsteer! On our ford tractor you have to take the starter off to replace the block heater. Other than the loader arms in the way it's not to awful of a job.

Larry NEIL · Jan 13, 2013

Around here, most fellas in the snow removal business rely on the glow plugs to start them. It isn't feasable to go tow out 5-6 machines to different jobs on slick roads, so they leave 'em sit onsite. No place to plug in there.
I didn't do snow, but worked lots of times digging or backfilling when temps were close to zero. Not much choice as we had to wwork when they needed it done. Always kept entire starting system in top shape, glow plugs, starter and battery and either with the JD stuff an it always ran. never could stand a machine that wouldn't start or a cracked/ripped up seat where you'd get a wet azz 1st thing in the morning!

Anonymous-0 · Jan 13, 2013

Some diesels just plain won't start when it gets too cold without being plugged in. It doesn't mean it's a bad engine though. The Kubota in my skid steer is one of them. About -10C it might start with just glow plugs but it's iffy. Glow plugs also use a lot of power so leaving them on for a minute or longer can drain the best battery enough that it won't crank the engine fast enough. Most people in snow removal have a way to plug their machines in or park them inside. When you've got time sensitive contracts to do, you can't be fiddlin' around to get machines started. Usually a machine is started and left running the whole time even when trailering from job to job.

Bob Bancroft · Jan 13, 2013

You give manufacturers/distributors way too much credit. They don't care.
I got a used CaseIH Magnum, which happened to originate from the deep south. Had factory coolant heater and starting fluid injector!
My used Ford 655A backhoe originated somewhere around the Phila/Del/Mar/Va area, and came with only the original "thermostart". Hardly enough for cold weather.
What I really don't understand is I have four Cummins engines which start amazingly well. All have factory starting fluid injectors, which I never use. In fact I tore the the one off the truck. The same truck where someone had to add the fuel heater later!

keh · Jan 13, 2013

It's not just in the frigid north that diesels are hard to start. In my part of SC they can be a pain. Many times I wished I had a block heater. One tractor has a heater on the intake manifold. Turn the motor over a few times to get the fuel flowing, stop, turn on the heater until there is a pop from fuel being ignited by the heater, then crank tractor. Another tractor just has a hand lever and supposedly you can pump it to get fuel into the system and then it will start better. I was having problems starting it and would hook a battery charger to the battery that was set on 50 amp boost which would start it. I didn't have to be very cold to have to do this, about 30 degrees. Found that the battery was too small and had a bad cell, have a new bigger battery now and so far all has been well. The other tractor has glow plugs and I have been getting better starting after replacing all but one of the glow plugs. Ether is not a good solution for any of these tractors, especially the one with glow plugs.

KEH

guido · Jan 13, 2013

Hello bushogPaPa,

Actually......... a good battery will have 65% of its rated CCA,@ 0* F. Even at that power output, cold starting aids would not hurt a bit!

Guido.

Adirondack case guy · Jan 13, 2013

When a tractor or any machine is ordered by a dealer, (companies don't just ship them because they have one built) that dealer specs. the unit to his best judgement, or to customer specs if a presale has been made. Such things as weighting, block heaters, optional lighting, cab radios, etc. are all dealer installed in most situations. Often tractors get transfered from one dealer to another, sometimes all the way across the country. There is no such thing as a genaric tractor or skidsteer for South Dakota, or Florida.
That being said, there were in the past designations such as "Wheatland", "Western", "Delta, or Rice", and "High Clearance" which had certain characteristics, but the dealers still had option choices on the engine (gas, diesel, Lp) tire size and type, (sometimes brand) and other small things.
A good dealer in your area will know what most customers expect, and is willing to install lesser requested items. Other words read the order and make sure what you are buying has everything you want on it
Loren, the Acg.

JMS/.MN · Jan 13, 2013

Which model Gehl? I had a 4625 with Kubota 46 hp engine- Just flip up the cage and it faced the front of the machine. Had to replace the plug once in about 12 years after buying it 4 years old. My current one, 5635? is worse to work on...rad does not tip out.

JMS/.MN · Jan 13, 2013

No, it"s a 6240e. I think!

Lazy WP · Jan 13, 2013

My skidsteer will start, and warm up to operating temp, but the fuel filter gels up. Still haven't gotten the snow pushed out of the yard from yesterday. I have enough Howes in it that it should never gel. My old 830 Case on the other hand, needs to be plugged in, but I have never had to add any conditioner to it yet. Running straight #2 in both, other then the Howes.

Erik Ks farmer · Jan 13, 2013

That's the plight of a poor man, Loren, I always end up with used equipment. A guy never gets exactly what he wants that way. I need to install block heaters on my combine and on the skid loader. Most of the time I don't run the loader in extreme cold but it's cheap insurance against a headache.

JayinNY · Jan 13, 2013

You forgot row crop! Lol

Kow Farmer · Jan 13, 2013

Hi JMS,
Mine is a 1989 3610 Gehl with the Isuzu diesel. Yes the cab flipped back for access. But the cross frame is about 4" away from the head. And the hydraulic pump line is in that area too. Just hard to get one hand in there and very little room to tighten the new block heater screw. But I did it. Glad that job is done.
Kow Farmer (Kurt)

scotc · Jan 13, 2013

How hard is it to see the actual heater? If it's outta sight I would just pulled the cord.

pete 23 · Jan 14, 2013

Sounds like the John Deere tractors with the fuel tank up front. Start them up, warm up, go down the road and gell. Also, I am pretty sure your anti gel was in there for a long time but most of them will not do the job if the fuel is not warm when the anti gel is put in. That was a problem we used to run into all the time as customers would pour it in after it was already gelling or not jelled but fuel was too cold for it to work.

pete 23 · Jan 14, 2013

But that would not put the block heater back in stock like boss wanted. He didn't get paid for it.

block heaters

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