wilson ind
Well-known Member
Extending wiring in tool shed. Bought 25 feet of wire labeled 14/2 with GROUND. NOW what to do about neutral????????????????? Plan on Black wire for 120 volt, white to Whatever it's called!!!!!!!
- Thread starter wilson ind
- Start date
Brian G. NY
Well-known Member
I know you"re trying to get a laugh here.....right?
Phil in Pa
Member
I can't wait to see this. I don't post to these electrical threads much, but I love to read them.
MarkB_MI
Well-known Member
- Location
- Motown USA
As Jackie Gleason used to say: "And away we go!"
wilson ind
Well-known Member
No, just want one light bulb and possible drop cord very seldom. Not sure what to consider white and bare copper as on the outer cover of the wire its labled 14/2 with GROUND.I thought after trying to understand past post on electricity the outer cover would be 14/2 with neutral!!
60 acre hillside
Member
Why not if the demand (amperage) is not too much?
Russ from MN
Well-known Member
- Location
- Bemidji MN
If you are this confused about the neutral you should probably get some professional electrical help. A small mistake could be very bad.
Russ from MN
Well-known Member
- Location
- Bemidji MN
There would be absolutely nothing wrong with using 14-2 wg for 220v, as long as it's protected by a 15a breaker. The new submersible pump I put in last week only draws 5a on 220v. The whole reason for going to higher voltage is to reduce wire size.
That's a very basic question to be asking. Most stores sell electrical wire also sell thin paperback books that explain basic wiring to meet national codes. They used to be about 50 pages thick, are easy to understand with lots of diagrams, and they sell for under $10. If one of those doesn't clearly answer your question, bite the bullet and hire a professional.
Do you need to add extra circuit breakers?
Do you need to add extra circuit breakers?
mattwillson
Member
P.S. Knight and co have written and sold electrical code books for many years. Easy to read and you'll be confident that your doing things right. Also a good thing to have around when the "safety nazi's" drop in for a visit too.
buickanddeere
Well-known Member
Wrong place to try and save some money. Why are there skilled trades persons called electricians? Because there are rules and regulation to follow and trade knowledge to have.
Why people expect engineers that design bridges, dentists , lawyers, drivers etc to be qualified. Yet they think anybody can ask a couple of questions on the internet and perform a hazardous task?
Ask any electrician about the handy man wiring jobs they have found.
The basic techniqwue would be turn OFF all power.
The black hot wire goes to the circuit breaker, which is then snapped into place.
The white wire goes to the neutral bus.
The bare ground goes to a ground bus,OR it can go to the same neutral bus, where it is all connected onto the same bus and the big bare No. 6 bare copper ground wire carries all the neutral current, and maybe the fault ground current down to the 8' driven ground rod.
Make sure you use a GFCI - protected circuit breaker, it'll protect you. I run all my barn circuits, welder circuit, lights, grinders, drills, saws, etc. off GFCI protected corcuits. Works great.
The black hot wire goes to the circuit breaker, which is then snapped into place.
The white wire goes to the neutral bus.
The bare ground goes to a ground bus,OR it can go to the same neutral bus, where it is all connected onto the same bus and the big bare No. 6 bare copper ground wire carries all the neutral current, and maybe the fault ground current down to the 8' driven ground rod.
Make sure you use a GFCI - protected circuit breaker, it'll protect you. I run all my barn circuits, welder circuit, lights, grinders, drills, saws, etc. off GFCI protected corcuits. Works great.
120 volts requires two wires - not one. Hot leg (black or red) and a neutral (white). Ground can be the bare wire or green. If you're extending 240 volts - for most apps - you need three insulated wires. If you're "cheating" and using two insulated and a bare ground - mark the white wire with black or red tap to indicated it is a hot wire and not a neutral carrier. Why 14 gauge wire? Is this only a 15 amp circuit?
Hey neighbor, 14/2 with Ground has THREE WIRES.
Black is the UnGrounded (HOT) conductor
White is the Grounded (Neutral) conductor
Bare/Green is the Equipment GroundING conductor
Its 120 VAC from the UnGrounded (Hot) conductor
over to the Grounded (Neutral) conductor, that's
what powers your load. The Equipment GroundING
conductor (bare/Green) is there to provide a
dedicated low resistance return current path for
FAULT CURRENT ONLY, while normal return current
is carried by the Grounded Neutral conductor.
For a 120 volt single phase branch circuit THOSE THREE WIRES ARE ALL YOU NEED. Since its 14 gauge wire, you would want to use a 15 amp overcurrent protection device and any max continuous loads shouldnt exceed 12 amps.
Got it?? Any questions??
John T
Black is the UnGrounded (HOT) conductor
White is the Grounded (Neutral) conductor
Bare/Green is the Equipment GroundING conductor
Its 120 VAC from the UnGrounded (Hot) conductor
over to the Grounded (Neutral) conductor, that's
what powers your load. The Equipment GroundING
conductor (bare/Green) is there to provide a
dedicated low resistance return current path for
FAULT CURRENT ONLY, while normal return current
is carried by the Grounded Neutral conductor.
For a 120 volt single phase branch circuit THOSE THREE WIRES ARE ALL YOU NEED. Since its 14 gauge wire, you would want to use a 15 amp overcurrent protection device and any max continuous loads shouldnt exceed 12 amps.
Got it?? Any questions??
John T
Here's a bit of information for yall:
"The bare ground goes to a ground bus, OR it can go to the same neutral bus"
1) If its the initial main service entrance distribution panel, the Neutral Buss and Equipment Ground Buss are connected together on some panels, while on others there may be only one single common buss to which BOTH Neutrals and Grounds are wired.
2) HOWEVER if its a sub panel fed from the main panel above, the Neutral Buss and Equipment Ground Busses are separate (NOT tied together) and electrically isolated from each other in which case Equipment GroundING conductors (bare/green) are wired to the Ground Buss while the White Neutrals are connected to the Neutral Buss.
" and the big bare No. 6 bare copper ground wire carries all the neutral current, and maybe the fault ground current down to the 8' driven ground rod."
What you refer to as "the big bare No 6 copper ground wire" is actually the "Grounding Electrode Conductor" which leads to a "Grounding Electrode" (may be driven into earth copper rod or rods or other suitable electrodes).
IT DOES NOTTTTTTTTT CARRY ALL THE NEUTRAL CURRENT, (usually it carries NO current) the Neutral current is carried from the panel out to the utility transformer by the Neutral (aerial drop or buried) Conductor.
Hope this helps.
John T, Retired Electrical Distribution Design Engineer
"The bare ground goes to a ground bus, OR it can go to the same neutral bus"
1) If its the initial main service entrance distribution panel, the Neutral Buss and Equipment Ground Buss are connected together on some panels, while on others there may be only one single common buss to which BOTH Neutrals and Grounds are wired.
2) HOWEVER if its a sub panel fed from the main panel above, the Neutral Buss and Equipment Ground Busses are separate (NOT tied together) and electrically isolated from each other in which case Equipment GroundING conductors (bare/green) are wired to the Ground Buss while the White Neutrals are connected to the Neutral Buss.
" and the big bare No. 6 bare copper ground wire carries all the neutral current, and maybe the fault ground current down to the 8' driven ground rod."
What you refer to as "the big bare No 6 copper ground wire" is actually the "Grounding Electrode Conductor" which leads to a "Grounding Electrode" (may be driven into earth copper rod or rods or other suitable electrodes).
IT DOES NOTTTTTTTTT CARRY ALL THE NEUTRAL CURRENT, (usually it carries NO current) the Neutral current is carried from the panel out to the utility transformer by the Neutral (aerial drop or buried) Conductor.
Hope this helps.
John T, Retired Electrical Distribution Design Engineer
I OFFER A CORRECTION with all due respect, I'm here to help not fight or argue remember.
14/2 with Ground is NOT for 110 v ONLY!!!!!!!!
Many many 240 volt ONLY single phase loads are served with 14/2 with ground wire. PROVIDED THAT theres no 120 volt use (and the max continuous current doesn't exceed 12 amps), Hey, there are a ton of 240 volt single phase motors out there ya know. In such a case, the 240 volt single phase is carried by the two insulated wires, while the bare or green serves as the Equipment GroundING Conductor.
Hope this helps
John T, Retired Electrical Distribution Design Engineer
14/2 with Ground is NOT for 110 v ONLY!!!!!!!!
Many many 240 volt ONLY single phase loads are served with 14/2 with ground wire. PROVIDED THAT theres no 120 volt use (and the max continuous current doesn't exceed 12 amps), Hey, there are a ton of 240 volt single phase motors out there ya know. In such a case, the 240 volt single phase is carried by the two insulated wires, while the bare or green serves as the Equipment GroundING Conductor.
Hope this helps
John T, Retired Electrical Distribution Design Engineer
"Yowch, I certainly wouldn't want to put 240 VAC on a 14 Gauge wire. Can you say POOF "
With all due respect to help NOT argue
Theres NO problem and its perfectly NEC permissible to put 240 VAC on 14 gauge wire provided its:
1) Rated for over 240 volts (could be 600 volt rated ya know)
2) Its protected by a 15 amp overcurrent protection device
3) The maximum continuous load does not exceed 12 amps
Over 40 years as an electrical engineer I probably specified well over a thousand branch circuits for motors or other small 240 volt loads that didn't exceed 12 amps using 14 gauge wire. And allllllllll were approved by NEC and other safety inspectors.
Hope this helps
John T Retired Electrical Distribution design Engineer
With all due respect to help NOT argue
Theres NO problem and its perfectly NEC permissible to put 240 VAC on 14 gauge wire provided its:
1) Rated for over 240 volts (could be 600 volt rated ya know)
2) Its protected by a 15 amp overcurrent protection device
3) The maximum continuous load does not exceed 12 amps
Over 40 years as an electrical engineer I probably specified well over a thousand branch circuits for motors or other small 240 volt loads that didn't exceed 12 amps using 14 gauge wire. And allllllllll were approved by NEC and other safety inspectors.
Hope this helps
John T Retired Electrical Distribution design Engineer
With all due respect, Im here to help not argue:
"but I would never consider putting 240 VAC on that kind of line."
That wire could be rated for 600 VAC so theres no problem is using 240 volts as long as the voltage withstand rating exceeds 240. Over many years as a design engineer I specified over a thousand 240 VAC 15 amp branch circuits using 14 gauge wire and all were approved by the NEC as well as local electrical inspectors.
John T Retired Electrical Distribution Design Engineer
"but I would never consider putting 240 VAC on that kind of line."
That wire could be rated for 600 VAC so theres no problem is using 240 volts as long as the voltage withstand rating exceeds 240. Over many years as a design engineer I specified over a thousand 240 VAC 15 amp branch circuits using 14 gauge wire and all were approved by the NEC as well as local electrical inspectors.
John T Retired Electrical Distribution Design Engineer
Told ya so lol. How many times have I posted that when even a simple simple electrical question is posed, everyone and their brother in law and Billy Bob and Bubba (and yes me lol) crawl out of the woodwork with opinions, some of which are technically accurate, while others can be DEAD wrong (as some are below). But thats why I love it here, there are many kind gents who are just willing and try to help and God Bless them for that. HOWEVER when life safety may be at stake, consult trained professional help NOT lay opinions, and DO NOT take my word for it, consult the NEC and local utility and authority.
DISCLAIMER the above is only an opinion, albeit a professional one, and it may be right and it may be wrong, I'm NOT saying, so NO WARRANTY. Its worth what was paid NOTHING so take or leave it as you please and no whining lol
John T Retired Electrical Engineer
DISCLAIMER the above is only an opinion, albeit a professional one, and it may be right and it may be wrong, I'm NOT saying, so NO WARRANTY. Its worth what was paid NOTHING so take or leave it as you please and no whining lol
John T Retired Electrical Engineer
wilson ind
Well-known Member
Sounds like I should consult my lawyer. Oh wait you are my lawyer!
Billy Shafer
Well-known Member
See John. This is why I stay out of questions like this. After 40 years in the power field. I got tired of trying to explain the proper. Electrical hook up. To people with the deer in the headlight look.
buickanddeere
Well-known Member
Ground wire goes to it's own ground bus bar.
In remote panels the neutral bar floats free of ground unless that darned fool triplex is used for a supply.
1st Panel, main panel or primary service should be the only place where a ground bond to neutral is supposed to hold neutral to earth potential. And keep 120V lines from exceeding more than 120V to earth.
dr sportster
Well-known Member
Your in trouble already by purchasing wire that [ and maybe you do] know the breaker size you are using for that circuit. White to white -Black to black..
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