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Phantom power loss at barn

P

Prawn Farmer

Member
I'm losing about 9kw of power per day and can't figure out where it is going. Electric co-op hooked up a test meter for a couple of weeks and it was 1kw less than mine. I have systematically eliminated different breakers and the only thing that stops the draw is the load center main. The 100 amp load center in the barn is supplied by overhead tri-plex from the meter pole with a disconnect. Any ideas?
 
We always told the customer the meter could not be faulty, could not run fast. But maybe it IS faulty. Maybe it is being read wrong?
 
One other thought, get a sensitive clamp-on ammeter, and check each circuit with your usage stopped, as far as you can determine. Might find some leakage.
 
I assume Kilowatt hours. 9000 divided by 24 hours would equal 375 watts of load. THat will make something warm in a hurry unless it is dissipated over a wide area. The strange thing you have indicated is that turning off the branch breakers does not stop the draw, but turning off the main in the same box does. This indicates one of two things, either the draw is in the box (not likely as it would be very toasty), or there is wiring internal to the box that bypasses the internal bus bars branching to each breaker. Disconnecting the meter (or switch at the meter if equipped), with foreknowledge of the electric company, will allow internal exploration of the panel. Jim
 
Am I understanding correctly, are you saying the Co-Op test-meter showed that the other meter [ "your" meter ] sat there running fast? Hard to believe, but if so, that indicates the Co-Op needs to replace "your" meter, with one that reads accurately.
 
I never tried it but maybe one of those pointing temp meters that finds heat. Very odd your main is drawing with all breakers off. Something in panel may be the problem . I would insist the power company swap out the meter. So with the main on you read amperage on an Amprobe and all the other breakers are off?
 

He is saying that the loss is real as it was verified by the co-op's test meter.
Time to look for hidden farmer wiring . And to megger the lines with everything isolated to find the path.
 
Lineman said that, if anything, they normally find meters run slow. It was less than 1-kwh difference in the 14 days with mine being very slightly faster or maybe ready to turn to the next kwh when he installed the test base. We wrote both starting figures with black markers on the glass meter faces. His first suspect was some 6-0 aluminum underground feeder connecting the main barn to another barn 100 ft away. I completely disconnected the underground feeder but the phantom draw was still there at the meter. My next step was eliminating one breaker at a time at the load center in the main barn without luck. The load center is a 100 amp SQ-D Homeline series and about 6 years old with nothing added since new.
 
has an overhead security light that was shorted, drew current 24-7 might be something to ck. see if it was like mine-hooked thru the meter but not thru the main.
 
How are you measuring the draw with breakers off? If all other breakers are off:Turning off main stops draw from where?
Meaning not so much where which is what you are trying to find out ,but how is this draw being measured?
 
When you find the problem let us all know. Been in the trade over 30 years and once in a while you can run into one of those unexplained "electrical phenomenons" that turn out to be rather simple when solved. Let us know what you find.
 
You say you shut off one breaker at a time. What happens if you shut off all but one at a time? You might have a short between the two hot wires somewhere.
 
I know this sounds crazy but my father complained his bills were too high. He pulled the main fuses on both panels and the meter still turned "some times" but not all the time. The problem turned out to be a bad ground on the neighbor's service. They shared a service transformer at the pole. Seemed that when their water pump ran it was grounding through dad's meter and making it turn thus advancing the reading. " Electric current WILL find the path of least restance ALWAYS!" Open circuits are harder to find than shorted circuits.
I had an instance where the customer were getting shocked all the time. They called the utility company, who put a meter on the water piping system detecting 120 volts. They pulled the meter, told the customer to "call an electrician", us. We plugged the meter back in and traced the short. Turned out to be the shallow well pump in the crawl space, which had been flooded out due to a backed-up sewer. The boss and I left after clearing the shorted circuit. Sure glad I wasNOT the plumber that got that service call!!

joe
 
We opened a load center at my sisters and found 14 gauge circuits wired to the subpanel lugs on ends of the strips! Breakered at 200 amps they would have made some great toasting elements.
 
First rule of troubleshooting is when you find something that doesn't make sense, back off until you find something that DOES make sense. There's a reason for everything, and sometimes the reason is you're making a bad measurement. How are you determining there is current draw? By your service meter, or do you have an Amprobe around one of the conductors? It sounds like something is tapped directly into the main of your load center. Another possibility is you have a bad breaker that's not opening. You can try removing all the breakers from the panel (keeping track of where they go) and see if that kills the current draw.
 
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