Stitch vs Welding

Did something real stupid and ended up with a hairline crack in the cast iron in the diffrential of my New Holland..Oil is leaking through.
Had a good welder come out and he can weld externally for about $350., but not happy that he can"t get into the inside and weld the crack there as well. Tearing it down to get inside would be way to complicated.
I was referred to a place nearby call Lock n Stitch that can stitch the crack and guarantee it never to leak. Costs between $800 and $900.
I"m leaning toward the stitching.
What do you guys think?

Thanks
Chuck

This is a very reliable method of crack repair.It always depends on the man doing the work.Years of experience is important.

A good welder should be able to weld the crack from the outside and make it hold. That is assuming the crack isn't in a spot that is receiving a lot of stress and strain. If it's just a matter of holding oil in, weld it. Once again, the guy welding it needs to know what he is doing. Bob

Get a good welder who will V grind the crack use Ni-rod and use a good sharp pointed chipping hammer to releave the strain after each small run. It would be a slow process. I have a son-in-law that does it all of the time and the weld hold and do not leak. He is so good that he is certified to weld blow out preventer for the oil-field.
gitrib

Hello Chuck (CA),
Stick welding the outside is sufficient.
I would suggest that the final weld be pressure tested through the vent in the housing.
Only a few PSI'S needed, and a little soap will show any leaks. There is really a lot of spalsh goimg on inside no pressure with the vent in it.
Guido.

Get a good welder or yourself and v out the crack.Drill a hole in each end of it so it wont spread.Heat with a torch until the paint burns off.Weld with 7018 about 3/4 of an inch at a time,peen with pointed chipping hammer,grind any slag that you still have out of your weld,weld again.Dont stop until you are done.On a long weld you may want to keep the torch handy and warm it up in front of your weld.Nickel rod will crack if it has any stress on it or you dont weld it just perfect with no slag in the weld at all.Hard to do unless you weld a lot and know what you are doing.Costs a lot too.7018 wont crack but it will crack beside it if you go too fast have slag in it,or dont do it right.
People will say lots of things.Chances are they are repeating what somebody told them.Nickel rod is weaker than 7018 and its brittle.For something that just sets in one place and doesnt move it might last a long time.Something like an axle housing will have stress and you want to fix it with 7018 as long as you do it right.It will cost less and be stronger when you are done,but it can still break.If you broke the original dont expect a welded one to take the same abuse,but it might last years at a less abuse level.Ive welded a lot,and still dont know everything about welding.I have welded construction equipment with 7018 on a cast piece and it was such good cast I welded it without stopping and didnt know any better.The first time it would crack sometimes,but I would quickly v it with a grinder and reweld it and those welds didnt break.You arent going to weld the drive wheel of a dozer with nickel rod and have anything you can use,it would break in no time.Several months later the drive wheel was still holding and that was the first time I ever welded cast.I got that from calling a welding shop and asking them how they would fix it.Since then I have welded a lot of stuff thats cast with 7018 and Mig.Mig is more brittle maybe but it will work and I like both 7018 and Mig better than nickel.There is a way with a torch to weld cast that is the best.It has to be taken all apart and heated up,veed out,welded with the torch,then cooled slowly.If I needed to fix it I would try the 7018 method first,if it didnt work try to find a place with a torch to fix cast,that way will still be cheaper and better than lock n stitch.The way you describe with lock n stitch is expensive,might work,and takes a couple of days or more to do.

You can weld cast steel with 7018 and you can weld contiuious with it like on other steels, this is what you probably welded. I would not recomend it on a cast iron axle housing. A good welder can weld it from the oustside by V ing the crack with a grinder or some form of arc cutting rod but not a torch. It can be welded with ni-rod or other casts done in the methods mentioned in the other post's however on a cast housing one method that works well and if done right will last better then most other methods is to braze your casting with a torch and bronze rod. This is an old school method that when done right will work better then most. Ask around and see if there is any one in your area capable of doing this.

Hi Pro Welder,

""A good welder can weld it from the oustside by V ing the crack with a grinder or some form of arc cutting rod but not a torch""

That is really not a true statement as I for one have made many weldments with a torch while using cast iron filler rods.

Our resident "cast iron welding" expert, GeorgeMD, also uses this gas welding method. You can find George's many articles on this website on welding cast iron by using the search function.

Sorry, I've never used the stitch plugs so I won't comment.

T_Bone<---29yrs AWS CWI

I have welded a lot.I have seen things brazed before like that and it will work,the problem would be finding somebody that could do it now days.Braze is a lot weaker than 7018.Less than half the strength maybe a quarter the strength of 7018.I know the difference between steel and cast steel.Nickel rod has its place but 7018 done like I said is the right way to fix cast steel.Most tractors are made out of cast steel.Cast iron is different and some of that might only be welded with nickel.Tractors like bulldozers are made of cast steel.Look at an old road grader or bulldozer where its been welded on a casting,they used 7018.I know what Im talking about.Now there are lots of better welders than me,but to weld cast steel you need to leave the nickel rod off of it,cast iron maybe.Cast steel is different than cast iron.I have had to grind too much of that stuff off so I could weld it with 7018 and braze that was done poorly as well.A good welder can fix it with 7018 or you can cobble on it from now on with nickel and braze.Somebody good at brazing,then put a patch over it and braze it and it might work,but gas costs way more than it did 40 years ago and it will take some.Welding with 7018 would be cheaper.I wont even mention 7018 is not the only rod that will work either as long as you do it the way I said 6011 and others will work.Basically if you can grind it with a grinder you can weld it with a welding rod with very good to poor results.Some rods might not work,some will.I saw a racer weld a 350 Chevy block with a 6011 rod,grind it with a 7 inch grinder,check it with a straightedge,slap a head gasket and head on it and go racing.I have welded my H Farmall rear end housing with a MIG and had to grind the braze off to get to it.It was a crack about 8 inches long with a couple of branches off of it and I heated it with a torch ahead of my welder,plus it was over head.Burned a couple of tips and nozzles up but got it done.Since then Ive used it for a bulldozer with a front end loader and knock on wood is still together.I dug a foundation for a building,spread rock,built a ramp up to a garage on the back of a house,dug out concrete foundation blocks from where a house burned down since then.When I got the tractor there was a big grease mess under it where it was leaking from the braze being cracked everywhere.Its dry and clean and painted now.

It really is a true statement, you will not have a lot of success trying to cut cast iron or V a crack with a flame torch. For that you are better of with a abrasive grinding wheel or some form of arc cutting rod. I am well aware of oxy acc cast rod, it is probably the best choice for repairing a cracked or heavealy damaged manifold.

Hi PW,

Sorry as I was reading your post wrong.

You were stating "cutting cast iron" where as I took it too mean "welding cast iron"

I need too learn too read better :>)

T_Bone

He is right about not cutting cast iron with a torch or not very well,which reminds me that if you have a broke off bolt in a casting you can torch it out,tap the threads and put a new bolt in.You have to be good with a torch but its possible and it wont cut the cast threads maybe.Anything can happen in a situation like that,but I have done it many times on Dayton wheels when a stud broke off in the cast hub.Also if you get cast hot enough anything is possible.Usually a torch and cast iron needs some knowledge of what you are doing,and could have something happen that you dont expect like breaking if you heat it up too hot in one place.I bet you could take a torch and turn one cast piece into two in a short period of time,cutting might not be the best word to describe it,but its possible to break it.

I don't know HOW the "experts" can advise you without knowing EXACTLY what the damage is or even what machine is involved. A little more information and a PHOTO or two certainly wouldn't hurt!

If you intend to keep the machine perhaps getting a good used casting from a "boneyard" would be the best long-term solution.

Chuck,

Being that I do quite a bit of cast iron
repair, yes it most likely can be welded but
best to stay away from any arc weld material.
it can be welded with oxy/acetylene and cast
iron in stick form , but to do it you will
need to empty the case ,clean it in hot tank,
do all the veeing and other prep,then it will
need to be inan oven to preheat to at least
1000 deg (slowly), welded ,and very slowly
cooled while still in the oven. Most likely
this process is not practical .

I also use the the supplies from lock n
stitch , they are a very good repair. The
fellow that designed and patented the pins
is Gary Reed ,i have talked to him and also
his brother who shows up here on YT once in
a while. If either one tells you he can
repair it ,he can do it . Both of them also
do much o/a cast iron weld . His brother
trades under - industrial casting and gear-
name is Guy Reed.

If you want to chat about it , send me an
email with a phone # and I'll call you.

george

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manifold repair

The real question is... How much would a "new" differential piece that is not broken cost you?

Look for a cast iron rod called Certainium.E xpensive but does a good job on cast.

What tractor? Where is the crack? That would make a difference to me as to whether I welded it or bought another housing.... but generally speaking, I would weld it, and I'd weld it with a NiRod (Sodel 335).
It must be a magic rod or something because I've never had any trouble with it, tho it certanly is expensive.

I'd also probably open the housing up so I could get inside and do the job right. You're not just worried about getting it oil tight. You want it strong.
If you've got time to do it half azzed twice, you've got time to do it right once...

I would think that your 900 (with absolutely no guarntees of success, whatever the claim) would come VERY close to covering the cost of your part from a salvage yard... This is why I ask what model. If it's one of the older Ford dereviatives you may find it far cheaper to just find a used part.

Rod

It's a New Holland T1510 with a hydrostatic transmission with 240 hrs on it. It was a harvest return and I had it 1 month. What I did was really stupid. I put on a brush hog and ignored the fact that the swinging drawbar was on it. The blade hit the drawbar and it tweaked the casing. The replacement case alone is 1200.00. The labor to replace all the guts would be much more than that; I don't have the smarts or the tools to do it myself.
I'm just sick over the whole thing.
If it had happened to my old TO35, it would have been a whole different story.

I think for 1200 I'd go that route and be done of it.
You're dealing with the mounts for the drawbar housing. That's not something to screw with, and not something you want in a weakened state.
Sure... it's going to cost you some labor, but probably not as much as you might imagine if you find someone local to do the work.
I view the 900 to stitch it to be about a crap shoot. With the new housing it's repaired. Correctly. Cheap isn't everything.

Rod

Hello Gentleman,
Metal Stitching has it's limits, just like everything else. I would like to see some pictures of the crack. Since the damage was do to an accident and not a structural defect this could be a good recipiant for Metal Stitching, but there is a lot to consider. Metal Stitching is a great process but you can't fix everything with it. And Remember My brother Gary that owns LOCK-N-STITCH has been repairing cast iron for 40 years, I have been doing the same for 35 years. DO NOT ARC WELD YOUR CASE!!!!!!!!!!!
If it needs to be welded, strip it down to a bare case and take it to LNS and have it Brazed.
Industrial Casting and Gear

I usually don't reply to welding questions, because everyone thinks they're an expert. There's a couple of guys on here who really are experts, though. The one thing that most people missed was cleaning. I don't care what method you use, if you don't take it apart and clean it, you won't get a good repair.