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USA parts and China parts

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Steve Mason

08-18-2003 09:23:29

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I guess this is just an observation but it sure seems to me that finding US made parts (for anything) is getting harder and harder. The US manufacturing base is in big trouble as all the industrial is moving to China. I think this is all a result of NAFTA but I am not politically astute enough to know for sure. Sure seems like a shameful thing to me. Having to buy Chinese parts to fix my American made tractor (and motorcycle). Don't tell me that Case parts are all made here in the USA because even Case is outsourcing to Chinese manufacturers. We cannot compete with them. They can produce parts so much cheaper that even with shipping, tariffs, etc the stuff comes into our shores cheaper than we can produce. Where will it end? It really is scary when you get to thinking about all that this means. Jobs gone, tax base gone, and we get Chinese products of varying degress of quality and China's economy keeps growing.
If I keep my tractor long enough, someday it will be all Chinese made. I am sure there is a positive side to this but
I can't find it.

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Carm

08-19-2003 07:47:11

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Re: USA parts and China parts in reply to Steve Mason, 08-18-2003 09:23:29

It is a sad state of affairs out there. This post could be a message board of its own. I do not shop at walmart because of their practices. I make every effort to avoid huge conglomerates and other large companies. I shop at small stores and the like.. Its not easy to do that in the east coast city where i live but I try.. It costs a lot more sometimes but I at least have some peace of mind when I buy something. If we stop patronizing these companies as a society maybe they will get the message (probably not, im just being hopeful).

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Steve Mason

08-19-2003 08:59:02

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Re: Re: USA parts and China parts in reply to Carm, 08-19-2003 07:47:11

Ya know Walmart is like the proverbial double edge sword. They make it so convenient and attractive to shop there and you have to admit, it is kinda nice to go to one place and get all the groceries, gas, etc. However, the flip side is insidious. How many towns have had their business districts destroyed by the Walmart on the edge of town? And then there's the China thing again. And to go deeper, what small business are left are sooner or later going to be buying their product from China/Mexico as well since the US won't have any manufacturing.

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Ben in KY

08-19-2003 08:58:05

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Re: Re: USA parts and China parts in reply to Carm, 08-19-2003 07:47:11

Yep you have the soloution. We ( the buyers) created much of this problem by buying Chinese stuff because it was cheap and not buying the higher priced American built stuff. If we as purchasers basically boycott cheap imported stuff then we will eventually see a return of more American products. Of course we all will pay the price of not having some stuff and paying more for what we do get. However this is the only way to change things and bring back more American products/jobs. We cannot have our cake and eat it too.

Remember the purchases we make are about 2/3 of the US economy. If we the consumers make it known what we want the manufacturers/retailers will respond or go under.

Well off of my soapbox for now....

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Carm

08-19-2003 10:02:14

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Re: Re: Re: USA parts and China parts in reply to Ben in KY, 08-19-2003 08:58:05

It is settled then....We will start a movemen right now, who else is in?

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Steve Mason

08-19-2003 06:57:43

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Re: USA parts and China parts in reply to Steve Mason, 08-18-2003 09:23:29

wow - certainly seems I am not alone in my observatons. Just to further prove the point, I work for a wholesaler of electrical and lighting products as web master. I also am responsible for checking and answering email inquiries that come in over our web site. I get, at minimum, 4 emails per day from Chinese firms who want us to sell thier products. Light bulbs, ceramic lamp sockets, wire & cable, fuses, you name it, the Chinese are making it and hawking it in the USA.
I quietly delete any and all email I get from China but it makes me wonder how long it will be before we have no other source for product.
If my little midwest based company gets that many emails from China, can you imagine how many Chinese solicittations are taking place every day across this country? I fear too many busineses will not consider what impact buying from China has on our country, but they will consider only their bottom line. I guess when you boil it down, the bottom line is the bottom line.

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KURT (mi) again

08-19-2003 02:22:07

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Re: USA parts and China parts in reply to Steve Mason, 08-18-2003 09:23:29

I have been thinking about this. Case in point. I just bought a Maglight flashlight this past weekend, $20. I have wanted one for a long time and I was tired of the $5 cheap crapping ones from China breaking in 3-6 months even before the batteries died out. So I bought a Durable long lasting light that is Made the USA. at least it says it is. Here is my point--The American consumer is looking for the best price--always--and he or she doesnt care where it comes from. (at least most dont care) But what happens when Americans cant afford to buy anything because they dont have a job, simple they stop buying because they dont have money and since the Chinese work for us through consumer products like flashlights and kids toys and low-medium quality stuff then the Chinese lose their jobs too because they dont buy anything from the US. unfortunately millions of Americans will lose their jobs until this happens. The politicians need to make the Chinese currency traded on the world market and free their people from the communists. just venting steam.

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Merlin

08-18-2003 18:35:15

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Re: USA parts and China parts in reply to Steve Mason, 08-18-2003 09:23:29

A hot topic in school when I went (wow, seems so long ago)was that out leaders was on the track of making the U.S.A. a service nation and not produce anything. When I finally got old enough to go to work off the farm, that was still the topic. It seems like it is coming true now. I remember the unions in the construction business wouldn't use anything made in a foreign country. I saw a strike because some steel came in made in Korea. You couldn't park a foreign car in a union building parking lot. I know of but one left like that now. The union members has a paved parking lot and a gravel parking lot for the guys that has foreign cars. But the majority of Americams seem to love the little throw away cars that cost an arm and a leg to repair. Until the majority gets tired of it all, and as much as we hate it, we will have to contend with it.

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KURT(mi) Strong Dollar,w

08-18-2003 17:55:56

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Re: USA parts and China parts in reply to Steve Mason, 08-18-2003 09:23:29

The Chinese Rembini (dollar) is kept low by the chinese government so that US businesses will move there. How do you compete with a Chinamen making $5 a day. Simple--you dont, you just go out of business and sell off your equipment at half of what you paid for it. The US politicians are too stupid to realize this.

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26Red

08-18-2003 21:46:52

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Re: Re: USA parts and China parts in reply to KURT(mi) Strong Dollar,w, 08-18-2003 17:55:56

They probably see it, but since it doesn't have the public's attention right now they don't care. It might take a few more "blackouts" to get their attention. Most people don't have a clue to what's going on, even my friends seem shocked to find out jobs in the manufacturing industry are being lost to foreign competition. Then they think I'm referring to a low-skilled union job- so they don't care. Well I'm not, it's the high tech equipment operators, skilled craftsman and tech and college degreed people losing there jobs. It sure doesn't take a lot of brains to see the big picture. It's only a matter of time before the US economy is in a depression comparable to the 1930s..

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Steve - IN

08-18-2003 18:28:41

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Re: Re: USA parts and China parts in reply to KURT(mi) Strong Dollar,w, 08-18-2003 17:55:56

Kurt,
You're absolutely right about the under valued Chinese currency. If it floated to free market levels, Chinese goods would become 30 to 40 per cent more expensive overnight. As they don't buy much from the West, and they're bringing in lots of money anyway, and all they need to do is shoot anyone who wants a better life/better income -- there's little pressure for them to let the currency float.

The politicians here aren't all totally stupid (well, most of them anyway). All of us are consumers of some sort. Higher tariffs mean 100 per cent of us pay higher prices for nearly everything. As only about 20 to 30 per cent of us are truly producers (the rest being govt. workers, lawyers, and other drags on the economy), raising tariffs would benefit far less than half the population. So the numbers are simple; do you wanna go after 100 per cent of the vote, or 30 some per cent of the vote?

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Hugh MacKay

08-18-2003 17:54:01

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Re: USA parts and China parts in reply to Steve Mason, 08-18-2003 09:23:29

Steve: I have read all these posts to date. Your problems as a country are not a whole lot different than ours here in Canada. You and I and the general public elect governments to do a job for us. Problem is after elected these guys answer only to the corperate elite. The same corperate interests are making the profit in USA, Canada, Japan, China, Mexico, etc. You name the country if you can be replaced by someone, somewhere for 10% of the cost it will happen and the same corperate interests will reap the benefits. Time has long passed for this to be corrected. It's time for you each and everyone to confront that elected official and say, " Buddy you are working for me and all the other people that elected you, not that fellow in the gated village living in a $25,000,000. home." Public enemy number one is living amoung you. He's the guy with your elected representive in his hip pocket.

When I was a young lad many farmers believed it was an honourable thing to produce cheap food for the nation. And it probably was, today it is not about cheap food anymore, just cheap raw materials for the corperate elite to use in their plants.

I've been scratching my head for about the past 20 years wondering when the young to middle age working people of North America are going to revolt.

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Strong Dollar

08-18-2003 14:50:57

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Re: USA parts and China parts in reply to Steve Mason, 08-18-2003 09:23:29

One of the biggest problems has been the US's policy of maintaining a strong dollar. All the low inflation policies have hurt the US economy more then any really imagines. As foreign currencies slide in value compared to the US it makes our exports (what a joke) more expensive and our imports cheaper. After over 20 yeaars the dollar is worth more then double or triple what it was compared to European or Pacific Rim country's currencies. Goes back to William Jennings Bryant's speach about the farmers carrying the cross of gold. Without the protective tarrifs in place the working men are carrying the gold cross with the farmers.

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08-18-2003 12:38:05

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Re: USA parts and China parts in reply to Steve Mason, 08-18-2003 09:23:29

The company I work for is losing (and has lost) many jobs to both Mexico, and now Thailand. The Mexico situation has not been what they expected, as productivity and quality is very poor which has slowed the migration from the US and so far saved a few jobs. The upside here is they are really only good for our high volume long lead time products. Low volume, short lead time product is still manufactured here. Fortunately the plant I am in has a lot of the latter thus saving jobs here. We certainly have lost a lot of our high volume business due to the quality issues with foreign made product though. No matter how you look at it though it is a lose-lose situation for the USA (in my mind). We have priced ourselves out of a job, and the junk we buy is the result. I recently heard the numbers of shipping containers coming across the water it takes to "feed the monster" we know as Wal Mart. I don't remember the numbers, but they were staggering.

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26Red

08-18-2003 13:43:17

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Re: Re: USA parts and China parts in reply to FC, 08-18-2003 12:38:05

I heard Walmart was responsible for 10% of the US imports with China. The big joke around work now is that we are all taking foreign language classes in chinese, and spanish.

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08-18-2003 13:58:42

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Re: Re: Re: USA parts and China parts in reply to 26Red, 08-18-2003 13:43:17

I know you certainly do not hear much about their products being made in the USA any more like we did when Sam was still alive. I believe he at least tried to keep some of it here.

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Delbert

08-18-2003 12:03:17

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Re: USA parts and China parts in reply to Steve Mason, 08-18-2003 09:23:29

I agree, either china or mexico we will be the poor nation before long. With cheap labor huh.

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26Red

08-18-2003 11:34:19

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Re: USA parts and China parts in reply to Steve Mason, 08-18-2003 09:23:29

I work in the manufacturing industry as a engineer. China is the hot topic in all the industry magazines... We can't compete even with our new technology. It is cheaper to have a casting made and machined in China, than it is for me to buy it here in the US and machine it at our company. China has 30% tariffs on imports with the US has 3% on Chinese imports. My company has also seen spin offs of our own product from China- they were more like exact xerox copies. It took a while for management to wake up and start reguluating what parts gets quoted by Chinese companies. Most of the time management is concerned with the bottom line of the company- stock prices...I doubt things will change on a corporate level. About the only thing I can do is try to further automate the manufacturing processes in the plant to reduce costs.. which creates more high tech jobs for the guys running the equipment(good). I have already realized I will not retire in this industry, it will probably end up in Mexico.. so I'm looking at other ventures. When will the government wake up and realize free trade is not going to help the US base of the economy??? We are digging hole we will never get out of. We are selling ourselves out of a JOB!!!

Sorry for the rant... but I had to vent.

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rustyfarmall

08-18-2003 12:04:31

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Re: Re: USA parts and China parts in reply to 26Red, 08-18-2003 11:34:19

Rant all you want, I already lost my job because of this situation. I am too young to retire, and too old to be hired again. It really hurts.

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Bigdog

08-18-2003 12:46:17

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Re: Re: Re: USA parts and China parts in reply to rustyfarmall, 08-18-2003 12:04:31

I'm right with ya rustyfarmall. 33 years on the job and I will be laid off Sept. 15.

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Ol Chief

08-18-2003 17:03:58

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Re: Re: Re: Re: USA parts and China parts in reply to Bigdog, 08-18-2003 12:46:17

I concur with everyone's posting on this subject.Unfortunately our government is primarily operated for the most part by lawyers or think tank specialists.Few people in congress were ever at any level is business or if they were they held high positions which pretty much insulated them from the working man's problems. On the subject of China,it seems that the Presidents tax cut plan may not benefit our economy as much as planed. Last week one of the networks reported that lots of people are spending their tax refund checks at WALMART.Good solid American based company with purchasing headquarters in China.There is little that we can do about the problem except to continuously bombard the White House and our elected reps. with mail or fax. with the facts such as those stated in the previous postings.

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Brett

08-18-2003 13:38:31

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Re: Re: Re: Re: USA parts and China parts in reply to Bigdog, 08-18-2003 12:46:17

I think its fricken stupid the way they treat people that made the companys what they are. it makes me sick to see them go to china because we dont need there products, we need AMERICAN products.

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justin

08-18-2003 10:22:41

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Re: USA parts and China parts in reply to Steve Mason, 08-18-2003 09:23:29

You can be sure of where the parts were manufactured when you purchase them thru case IH, as they are clearly labled on the package as to their orgin. I don't know of any case IH parts that are produced in china, but I do know that when I helped an uncle of mine replace the chopper bearings on a JD7720 a few years ago, the bearings we recieved from JD were marked PRC (Peoples Republic of China) I had an identical bearings made by fafiner (in IH boxes) on the shelf, and offered them to my uncle for free, but he wanted the JD parts installed. the bearing didn't last the remainder of harvest, so he replaces the JD bearings every season now.

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One Row

08-18-2003 10:13:34

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Re: USA parts and China parts in reply to Steve Mason, 08-18-2003 09:23:29

In a senate hearing Alan Greenspan (Federal Reserve Chairman) was recently asked about job loss in the US (i.e. Manufacturing Jobs) and his response was that those jobs are "Obsolete".

Sure they are when you trade with 1.2 billion communists that get paid .23 to .50 cents an hour. China: No EPA, OSHA, and no LABOR UNIONS, RIGHT TO VOTE, Religion or FREE SPEECH. Then the Chinese Government takes the US trade money profits to build China's Infrastructure and it???s military. And then China's says a war with the US is inevitable in the future.

Truth: Buy your enemies products and make US wealthy political contributors richer and dam your countries and children???s future.

Let Freedom Ring.

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rustyfarmall

08-18-2003 09:59:39

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Re: USA parts and China parts in reply to Steve Mason, 08-18-2003 09:23:29

There is no positive side to it. The U.S. manufacturing jobs are all going to foriegn countries, pretty soon all of our jobs will be gone, as well as our income, and then we won't be able to buy even the junk that is coming from China. Eventually China will give up, and the jobs will return to the U.S.A., but probably not in my lifetime.
The really scary part is that those Chinese manufacturing firms are probably owned by Japan. Supposedly one of our allies?
I could go on and on, but I will stop here, the whole subject leaves a rather bitter taste in my mouth.

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