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Tractor Talk Discussion Forum

air to air aftercooler

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billyiron

01-01-2006 10:11:10




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I took this IH DT359 engine out of a bus, going to use it on a irrigation well, the load will be about 110 hp, the radiator had the air cooler and coolant radiator side by side,I need to put larger coolant radiator for the old one I think is too small,do you guys think I can forget the air to air cooler and route the boost air right to the intake,,the engine is rated 185 at 2700,it will be turning about 1950 on the well,,thanks ,billy

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RodInNS

01-02-2006 09:49:17




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 Re: air to air aftercooler in reply to billyiron, 01-01-2006 10:11:10  
I think I'd keep the intercooler. The engine was designed for it, and you don't know what other small changes may have been made to accomodate the cooler. There's probably more to it than simply driving more fuel at it. Beyond that, intercooled engines are generally more thermally efficient than straight turbo engines, which are more efficient than NA engines. It can't be that big of a deal to hook up the IC....

Rod

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Blue guy

01-01-2006 17:10:44




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 Re: air to air aftercooler in reply to billyiron, 01-01-2006 10:11:10  
You could try it without it, but I would get a pyrometer(to monitor egt) on it to know for sure. If the egt is high, you will have to put the aftercooler back on or adjust the fuel back down.



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Old Pokey

01-01-2006 10:40:14




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 Re: air to air aftercooler in reply to billyiron, 01-01-2006 10:11:10  
Is it a problem to put the air cooler on the pump frame somewhere? You should be able to remove the small coolant core from the stock bus setup and put it in front of the larger radiator. It dont even have to be completely in line with the cooling air path. It just needs some ait flow through it, not a lot. Especially with the lower hp you'll be using.



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billyiron

01-01-2006 10:51:01




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 Re: air to air aftercooler in reply to Old Pokey, 01-01-2006 10:40:14  
I can probably get it on there some way,,I was just tryin to take a short cut, also wondered if it was really needed for lower hp requirement,,thanks billy



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Old Pokey

01-01-2006 12:34:16




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 Re: air to air aftercooler in reply to billyiron, 01-01-2006 10:51:01  
In my limited experience, I've seen the manifolds are designed differently on the nature vs.,intercooled vs., aftercooled engines. Usually it seems, it's easier and better to "add" a cooler than to subtract one. But, my info is worth about what you pay for it.:-) You might try redpowermagazine with this question also, as there are several navistar engine fans over there.



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JDknut

01-01-2006 10:19:20




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 Re: air to air aftercooler in reply to billyiron, 01-01-2006 10:11:10  
You'd be upsetting the fuel-air balance, as without the aftercooler, the intake air will be warmer, and thus less dense and therefore less oxygen to burn the fuel. The engine was designed for those exact parameters of cooled intake air, so you would probably have an overfueled condition. An engine that is overfueled wastes fuel and carbons up the injectors faster and won't last as long as the excess fuel washes off the cylinder walls. You might be able to correct it by adjusting the fuel rate, but if it were me, I'd use the aftercooler. This is my take anyway, perhaps an IH specialist can come up with a better one.

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Bob

01-01-2006 11:37:51




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 Re: air to air aftercooler in reply to JDknut, 01-01-2006 10:19:20  
As far as overfueling, it would only overfuel at max load. If he is running it at considerably less than max load, it's not gonna "overfuel".



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buickanddeere

01-01-2006 19:36:54




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 Re: air to air aftercooler in reply to Bob, 01-01-2006 11:37:51  
I agree with Bob. Extra unused air/oxygen going through a diesel operated at light load just wastes fuel. The extra air just carries extra heat up the stack. Now when operated at 1950rpm that engine would max HP at about 145HP with the intercooler. Operating without the intercooler maybe about the ideal point on this pump. As previously stated the EGT has to watched. If too high the engine will become scrap. One of the main reasons for intercoolers today is emissions. The overall combustion temps are lowered which reduces the amount of NOX formation under heat and pressure from nitrogen.

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