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Tractor Talk Discussion Forum

Runaway diesel engine

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Laborie

03-02-2007 10:29:00




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My neighbour has recently bought an old Deutz 40 aircooled tractor with a bosch injector pump. It hasn't been started for over 3 years. I managed to start it the other day but it ran faster and faster and I couldn't see the front of the tractor for smoke! I slackened the injector pipes to stop it before it blew up!
Anyone have ideas whats wrong?




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buickanddeere

03-03-2007 18:21:34




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 Re: Runaway diesel engine in reply to Laborie, 03-02-2007 10:29:00  
An over filled oil bath aircleaner will make a diesel run away as well. May even run it for hours before hand at modest rpms. Then then wound up to high rev's the oil will start carrying out and over the aircleaner into the engine.



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eamonn cerolan

03-03-2007 13:32:05




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 Re: Runaway diesel engine in reply to Laborie, 03-02-2007 10:29:00  
same thing happened to my john deere 710 4 cylinder ,ran mad for a few minutes then siezed fault with governer



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Burnie

03-03-2007 02:59:27




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 Re: Runaway diesel engine in reply to Laborie, 03-02-2007 10:29:00  
Had a Cummins on an irrigation pump that ran away once (stuck rack). The boss and I both bolted to the shed at the same time and got stuck shoulder to shoulder in the door way. Must have looked like the three stoogers. Eventually got in and shoved a rag down the air intake. Had to have a stiff drink and a little lie down after that!



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NC Wayne

03-02-2007 17:39:30




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 Re: Runaway diesel engine in reply to Laborie, 03-02-2007 10:29:00  
Have to agree with Bob, sounds like the rack is stuck. The injectors are held in the full fuel position by the rack and as the engine speed increases the governor pulls them back to the set speed. With the rack stuck the governor can't pull the injectors back so the engine goes wide open.



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Walt Davies

03-02-2007 17:17:09




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 Re: Runaway diesel engine in reply to Laborie, 03-02-2007 10:29:00  
I was engineer on the small boats on the ship they all had 6/71 Grey marine engines. (same as GMC or Detroit but made for marine use) The one thing we were always scared of was run-a-way we ran them at 2600 RPM except in battle then we ran them at 2900 RPM just a few RPMs below run-a-way speed which is 3000 to 3100 RPM.
You had to be real careful when running these old GMC engines. They would suck the oil right out of the crankcase at speeds over 3000 RPM. Even a brand new one would do that. Later on I worked on a big amphibious vehicle that the army had it had 4 6/71 engines on it. we had to run the rack before we started them and get them all setup correctly. Then we ran them for 4 hours down river to set the RPMs you did this by watching the temp gauges if they ran hot back it off if cold set it up a bit till they all ran the same temp. Boy you learn a lot working on this military stuff. Walt

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Lumpy

03-02-2007 16:46:17




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 Re: Runaway diesel engine in reply to Laborie, 03-02-2007 10:29:00  
The "rack" is stuck. Seen this many times. I work with my brother in-law alot, he is a diesel mech, he always keeps a garbage bag handy to throw over the intake to "choke" off the air. One day we were standing at the local imp dealer waiting on his tractor. There was a young mech working on a new combine that had just 200 hrs. on it. He started the engine to back it out and the thing went wide open. Engine was just scream'in. As the mech threw the ladder down to climb up to the engine it locked up and put a rod out the side. What a way to start a saturday morning!

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Kevin (FL)

03-02-2007 13:31:44




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 Re: Runaway diesel engine in reply to Laborie, 03-02-2007 10:29:00  
My two cents:

1) Air in fuel system?

2) Stuck mechanical governor--unable to control & limit engine speed?



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Don Wadge

03-02-2007 11:40:32




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 Re: Runaway diesel engine in reply to Laborie, 03-02-2007 10:29:00  
Bob may well be correct. You should also check to see that your air intake is not severely restricted , as in extremely dirty filter or blockage. I had a VW Rabbit diesel do this many years ago and it was the air filter. The engine was in good shape and I'm not really sure if it was sucking oil up past the rings or sucking it in through the injectors but it launched. Volkswagen mechanic said it was the clogged air filter and not the first time he'd seen it.

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Hard Knocks

03-02-2007 11:40:04




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 Re: Runaway diesel engine in reply to Laborie, 03-02-2007 10:29:00  
That was so common on old Detroits that they had a cutoff latch on the air cleaner intake to cut air off to the engine.Also some engines are capable of sucking fuel back thru the injector return lines to enable it to run away.



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Bob

03-02-2007 11:42:01




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 Re: Runaway diesel engine in reply to Hard Knocks, 03-02-2007 11:40:04  
The old Detroits had a "blower" in which oil seals would fail, providing a direct path for the crankcase oil to be forced into the air induction system.

NO "blower' on the Deutz.



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george md

03-02-2007 11:33:15




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 Re: Runaway diesel engine in reply to Laborie, 03-02-2007 10:29:00  
Typically you have over speed engine and

runaway operator .

george



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Bob

03-02-2007 10:49:01




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 Answer shopping? in reply to Laborie, 03-02-2007 10:29:00  
Didn't you like the honest, most likely correct answer I gave you over on "Tales", or are you answer shopping" until you find one you like???

The answer I gave you was specific, and for the construction of the Bosch IP like you mention.

In case you missed it, I'll copy it here:

Most likely, the "rack" is stuck. This is the internal linkage from the governor, past each injection plunger. The "rack" has gear teeth cut into it that engage with gear teeth on each injection plunger, and rotate the plunger, affecting how the "helix" on the plunger indexes with holes in the plunger barrel, controlling fuel rate.

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John T

03-02-2007 10:37:52




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 Re: Runaway diesel engine in reply to Laborie, 03-02-2007 10:29:00  
Diesels are NOT my thing but I can tell ya the same thing happened on an old VW Rabbit 4 cylinder 4 cycle diesel engine I had (run away) and the reason was the rings/cylinders were badly worn allowing crankcase oil to get sucked up past the rings into the combustion chamber so she was runnin away on its own engine oil and she smokeddddd big time (burnin oil) n ran fast as a rabbit till I got her shut down. On the old 6 71 2 cycle Detroit 2 cycle diesel engines they had an emergency shut off which was a big flapper in the intale to choke off all air in case of run away.

John T

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Don Wadge

03-02-2007 11:32:07




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 Re: Runaway diesel engine in reply to John T, 03-02-2007 10:37:52  
The most likely cause of this on the VW diesels is a very dirty air filter. They will suck in enough fuel to rev out of control and still get enough air to do it.



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Bill46

03-02-2007 10:34:12




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 Re: Runaway diesel engine in reply to Laborie, 03-02-2007 10:29:00  
Sounds like some of the old 2 stroke diesels...started sucking oil out of the crankcase and using it for fuel. Had 150KW generators do that and you had to block the air supply to make them stop...before they scattered themselves all over the area.
They would just keep going faster and faster...real scary.



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