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Tractor Talk Discussion Forum

Veg. oil in diesel, again...............

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Sparktrician

03-19-2008 06:40:15




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With road fuel at 4.09, really wanting to do something different. I know this stuff has been discussed alot, but how does running the veg oil (used cooking oil) work for diesels? I have a 96 F350 powerstroke, about 200K miles. Dont want to hurt my motor but would like to do something. I have heard of "kits" to buy that have additives and info you need, explaning how to concockt this stuff. Any one do this, any first hand experiance? am i wasting my time?

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Sparktrician

03-19-2008 12:44:35




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 Re: Veg. oil in diesel, again............... in reply to Sparktrician, 03-19-2008 06:40:15  
SO, you guys think i could run 10% used motor oil in my truck, and possibly use Veg oil. Where do you get new canola oil? (not cooked with?) I really would like to do this kinda stuff, just to keep less money going to big oil and towel heads and the like. Has anyone used any of the kits offered on the internet? are they neccesary?



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low budget

03-19-2008 20:09:56




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 Re: Veg. oil in diesel, again............... in reply to Sparktrician, 03-19-2008 12:44:35  
I've mixed used engine oil with fuel oil to heat my house, but would be hesitant to use it as diesel fuel. If its too dirty for the crankcase, why would you want to run it through an injection pump and injectors? Just my opinion.



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kubota man

03-19-2008 09:40:15




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 Re: Veg. oil in diesel, again............... in reply to Sparktrician, 03-19-2008 06:40:15  
dont put any kits or evian bio deisal in your truck i put bio deisal in my truck one time and it all gelled up in the tanks and had to pay a lot of money to get the tank pulled and kleened.



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Mike (WA)

03-19-2008 09:29:05




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 Re: Veg. oil in diesel, again............... in reply to Sparktrician, 03-19-2008 06:40:15  
I think the supply of used cooking oil is pretty well spoken for, at this point, but how about "new" cooking oil? How much does soy or canola oil cost, in bulk? Any cheaper oils that would work?

A new biodiesel plant went in at Hoquiam, Washington a couple years ago- big outfit, employs 400 people. But its on the coast- far away from the supply of canola grown in eastern Washington. I figured it was because they planned to import palm oil by boat- there's a lot of palm plantations sitting idle in the tropics, after palm oil was found to be unhealthy because of high saturated fat content. Don't know if they're using that or not, but just found out they export every drop of biodiesel they make- they say they can get better price abroad. They got a bunch of subsidies to build the plant, paid for by you and me, and now all of the production goes overseas. Isn't that wonderful?

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JDknut

03-19-2008 09:01:39




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 Re: Veg. oil in diesel, again............... in reply to Sparktrician, 03-19-2008 06:40:15  
I knowe a guy that runs straight used cooking oil in his Ford Powerstroke pickup "tractor-trailer", hauling cattle all over the place. He filters it and puts it in the tank. He has done it for 3 or 4 years now. He installed an elaborate second heated fuel system: tank, lines, filters, etc. all heated by engine coolant. Start on petro-Diesel, then switch over to cookin' oil, then switch back just before shutdown. Says it runs good, good power and economy. Cost 70 cents a gallon.

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36 coupe

03-20-2008 03:12:47




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 Re: Veg. oil in diesel, again............... in reply to JDknut, 03-19-2008 09:01:39  
The supply of used cooking oil has to be limited.



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thurlow

03-19-2008 08:10:22




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 Re: Veg. oil in diesel, again............... in reply to Sparktrician, 03-19-2008 06:40:15  
O.T. a little..... ...A LOT? Was gonna post this picture last week and couldn't find it; after all the discussion about the price of fuel, alternative fuels, wood burning vehicles, sustainable agriculture, subsistence farming, small acreage farms, etc, I was reminded of it (picture). It was in the pictures Dad made in Western Europe in either '44 or '45. It could have been in Holland, Belgium, France, Luxemburg or Germany, since those were the countries he was in (picture is not dated or identified by place). Quality is not good because the original was only 2 by 3 inches.

third party image

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jdemaris

03-19-2008 07:24:51




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 Re: Veg. oil in diesel, again............... in reply to Sparktrician, 03-19-2008 06:40:15  
I've done it, off and on, for 30 years. My son uses it now in my old 87 Chevy Suburban with a 6.2 diesel. I don't think he's saving a penny - but he's having fun doing it. I used to just pour used cook-oil through a cheesecloth and then dump it straight into my old Mercedes. Never had a problem - but . . . I never ran more than a 50% mix, I was living in a warm area at the time, and the old Mercedes had an in-line injection pump which could handle a lot more abuse than some modern pumps.

There are several issues - and information is easy to get. I suggest you read up on it.

Just remember a few things. Waste vegetable oil i.e. WVO - e.g. from a deep fryer is different than using virgin uncooked oil that you select and know exactly what it is i.e. SVO.

You go to McDonalds and get a load of used oil, you don't know what it's chemical makeup is. It must be filtered, deacidfied, dewatered, and in most cases preheated to keep it thin enough to use. Also if used 100% it needs to be setup just like an old dual-fuel tractor with two tanks. You start on pump diesel, and then switch over to WVO. You must remember to switch back before shutting down.

Bio-fuel at the pump is different in many ways. One important factor is - the vegetable oils are selected for having good qualities as a motor fuel - like soy or canola oil.

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greygoat

03-19-2008 07:14:42




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 Re: Veg. oil in diesel, again............... in reply to Sparktrician, 03-19-2008 06:40:15  
Clean, filtered, used engine oil can be added
to diesel fuel, up to 10 or 15 %. I have read
that it was approved by International/Navistar
but someone needs to do more research here.



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John M

03-19-2008 13:59:09




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 Re: Veg. oil in diesel, again............... in reply to greygoat, 03-19-2008 07:14:42  
What is clean, filtered used oil? :)



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mkirsch

03-19-2008 14:17:45




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 Re: Veg. oil in diesel, again............... in reply to John M, 03-19-2008 13:59:09  
Unless you live where it's really warm all the time, you need something to make the veggie oil work:

1. You can convert it to true biodiesel with methanol and lye. This removes the glycerine, the nasty stuff that gels up in your injector pump, from the oil. The end result can go straight into your tank at up to 100% concentrations.

2. You can heat and filter straight veggie oil right on your vehicle. This requires a separate heated tank for the veggie oil, a bank of filters, and a way to switch between regular diesel and veggie oil so your injectors don't gum up when you shut down.

The best way to go in either case is with some sort of a kit, unless you like to reinvent the wheel.
Biodiesel and veggie oil both have more lubricity than even the old diesel fuel. Properly filtered, they WILL NOT HARM YOUR VEHICLE'S ENGINE. Some older rubber hoses will need to be changed out, but other than that, no modifications need to be made to your engine or injector pump.
The person that says not to use veggie oil or biodiesel either works for big oil, or put dirty nasty oil in his truck without filtering, or his truck was ready to blow up anyway.

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flying belgian

03-19-2008 09:54:52




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 Re: Veg. oil in diesel, again............... in reply to greygoat, 03-19-2008 07:14:42  
I already did the reserch. I used to have a fleet of 5 trucks. always ran 10 percent used moter oil. Rigged up a make shift filter system nothing fancy. put hundreds of thousands of miles on them trucks and never had one fuel related problem.



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Big Hunter

03-19-2008 07:05:18




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 Re: Veg. oil in diesel, again............... in reply to Sparktrician, 03-19-2008 06:40:15  
I briefly looked into it once. The problem I ran into was where to get the used veg oil. I called about a dozen restaurants and they all are set up with the company that sells them the new oil. New oil delivered old oil removed. I think they sell the old oil to a dog food company and or protien company. And I just had a thought, I wonder if you can change used engine oil to diesel? Have plenty of that.

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IaGary

03-19-2008 07:13:54




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 Re: Veg. oil in diesel, again............... in reply to Big Hunter, 03-19-2008 07:05:18  
Local trucking firm "Hummer" dumps 1 to 2 quarts of drained motor oil in every tank of fuel.

No problems yet and adds back some of the lubricity that is lost in this new fuel.

Gary



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Glenn F.

03-19-2008 13:34:23




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 Re: Veg. oil in diesel, again............... in reply to IaGary, 03-19-2008 07:13:54  
Gary:
I've heard of people doing that before, but do you know how it effects fuel economy?

I do not know.


Glenn F.



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