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Crawlers, Dozers, Loaders & Backhoes Discussion Forum

John Deere 450B Transmission

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Jimmy

12-26-2003 12:57:35




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Diozer operated normally, then sat unused for apprx 1 year. Changed transmission fluid before use and it was very dirty and appeared that water had seeped in. Noticed that reverse would not pull like it should; it would back up on level ground but would not climb small hill of dirt. Forward would spin tracks and work normally. I was told that I should continue to use the dozer, but changed the tranmission fluid every few hours unitl reverse would work right (stuck valves, etc.??). Does this sound correct; any suggestions would be appreciated.

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jdemaris

12-27-2003 07:16:50




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 Re: John Deere 450B Transmission in reply to Jimmy, 12-26-2003 12:57:35  
Just adding my two cents here. I don't believe changing the oil will fix any of the problems. Most likely your problems are as the other respondent mentioned (worn clutch packs, actuators,etc). I worked as a JD mechanic for 30 years. Many of the 450s I worked on were loggers machines, and many of them had pretty bad looking oil in the trans - but still worked. One thing you might check, though . . . John Deere got caught up in a class-action law suit involving that transmission (HL-R) in every machine it was put in, incluing 2010s and all the 450s up to the "C" series as I recall. The suit involved reverse being too close to neutral, and the machine subsequently taking off on its own and killing someone. Supposedly, every HL-R transmission in existence was to be updated by Deere. I did many (more than I can count) of them. Part of the update is installation of a new hydraulic shift valve that provides a larger neutral area - and less reverse. I guess it's remotely possible your machine is not going fully into reverse? I've never come across one, but it's worth looking at. Also, a common problem in that transmission is low oil pressure due the the adjuster nut coming loose in the engine-clutch linkage.

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Steve

12-27-2003 06:02:54




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 Re: John Deere 450B Transmission in reply to Jimmy, 12-26-2003 12:57:35  
third party image

Jimmy: We do them here all the time and it is quite a job. But if you can find an independent repair shop that knows what their doing it should save you quite a bit.



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Jonathan

12-26-2003 15:18:46




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 Re: John Deere 450B Transmission in reply to Jimmy, 12-26-2003 12:57:35  
No ....this does not sound "right"...You can confirm it with a pressure guage, but it sounds like the reverse clutch pack has outlived its usefulness...There is a multiple clutch/plate "pack" for forward hi and low and one for reverse...no real valves that loosen up with use ...If the friction material on the clutch discs is worn off or the piston that clamps the discs together has deteriorated seals , or the metal sealing piston rings on the shaft that contains all these clutch packs have worn, then it will present with the symptoms you describe...all situations require disassembly of the transmission ....

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Jumpedthetrack

12-27-2003 00:21:51




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 Re: Re: John Deere 450B Transmission in reply to Jonathan, 12-26-2003 15:18:46  
Sounds right.Just had my 350b clutch pack done and it did the same thing before repair.It will cost some $$$$$ !



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L.S.

12-27-2003 21:18:32




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 Re: Re: Re: John Deere 450B Transmission in reply to Jumpedthetrack, 12-27-2003 00:21:51  
Well...here's a question for the 350 guys....everything ran & worked good, right steering lever had to be pulled back "a little farther than" left lever...parked it for one year (in the shed)...started up fine etc, no right steering, left is ok, right lever (when pulled back all the way)does nothing forward or reverse, and seems to have very little "resistance" to hand pull. Checked to make sure all linkage was intact (it was) and put it back in the barn (no time to fool with it). Any "where to start" advice will be welcomed and appreciated. I have "average+" mechanical ability and a barn full of worn tools, but no "specific" experience with the 350. Thanks in advance.

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jdemaris

12-31-2003 06:24:07




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: John Deere 450B Transmission in reply to L.S., 12-27-2003 21:18:32  
Problem could be a number of things. One being that 350s with dry clutches don't store well. I've worked on many of them that were working fine, then got parked for a year or so, and then would not work at all. Usually, there was moisture in the clutch housings, the fiber clutch disks swelled up while the machine was parked, and subsequently, there was nothing but free-play in the steering levers. Most of the time the machines had to be torn apart to fix. On rare occasions, you could reach in, readjust the fingers on the steering clutch pressure plates, use the machine, get the clutches hot, and then re-adjust them as they dried out. The steering clutch housings have drain-plugs on the bottom. Some people choose to leave them out so any moisture can escape. That works okay, until you forget they're out, and drive through a creek, snowbank, or something similar. This is one of the reasons that Deere changed over to wet clutches with the "C" series. They store just fine, but have their own set of problems.

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350 Guy

12-29-2003 04:32:01




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: John Deere 450B Transmission in reply to L.S., 12-27-2003 21:18:32  
This is a response for the 350 steering clutch problem. If you don't already have an operator's or service manual for your machine, pickup one. Remove the fuel tank or stand on your head, whichever suits you, take off the top access covers to the steering clutch adjustment linkage and follow the clutch/brake adjusting sequence called out by JD. Since you have no resistance on the lever, you might find that little short ball joint adjuster linkage has come loose. It is normally taken off during the adjustment procedure. Follow the steps and you might get lucky.

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