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Crawlers, Dozers, Loaders & Backhoes Discussion Forum

JD 350 Reverser replacement

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06-14-2004 05:38:22

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After rebuilding the reverser in a JD 350 crawler twice, I would like to replace the reverser with a standard clutch. I know I will need a new clutch housing and internal parts ect., but does anyone know what other parts will need replacement with this conversion? Anyone done this before? Thanks for any help Ed

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jdemaris

06-15-2004 19:44:09

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Re: JD 350 Reverser replacement in reply to Ed, 06-14-2004 05:38:22

The reversers used in the 350s are usually good for at least 5000 hours if done right. Mine has over 10,000 and it's never been apart. Although I've worked for several Deere dealerships, you're the first person I've encountered that wanted to change a reverser driven 350 over to clutch driven. We DID use to get quite a few 440 owners with that request, but those reversers were totally different. Again, a reverser done right will last a long time. As far as changing over, you'd be way ahead to strip a parts machine and get all the parts at once. Clutch disk, pressure plate, pedal linkage, powershaft, and case.

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06-16-2004 13:23:36

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Re: Re: JD 350 Reverser replacement in reply to jdemaris, 06-15-2004 19:44:09

Thanks John for taking the time for the reply!
Your experience is indeed appreciated!
Your statement that we should get 5000 hours on a rebuilt reverser sounds great to me. I hope I can get half that!
I rebuilt this reverser replacing all bearings, seals, gaskets ect. Had a "Cat certified" hydraulic mechanic do the work in his shop (with me hanging over his shoulder). After we reassembled and were done with the hydraulic pressure adjustments, we got about 1.5 hours on it and had a crunching noise in the reverser. Pulled it all down again and the restrictor port in the main clutch shaft became plugged and the little bearing ate itself up. The restrictor port is probably less that the dia of a pin. The hydraulic mechanic used a black grease to coat seals and parts (in lieu of lubriplate) and I think this was a factor in the plug up. The grease turned the fluid black and appeared (on the re-tear down) to leave a gummy residue.
Looked into buying a new front spider (to utilize the larger bearing) and they want $1100.00 for one. Seems awfull pricy to me. I am going to look into having the good front spider I have bored out to accept the later and larger bearing race.
I intend to redo this reverser myself this time "by the book", so we'll see what happens.
Any suggestions you might have would be appreciated.
Thanks
Ed

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Dozerboss

06-17-2004 09:32:34

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Re: Re: Re: JD 350 Reverser replacement in reply to Ed, 06-16-2004 13:23:36

Black grease?? That is usually high temp resistant for wheel bearings on disc brakes. No wonder the port was plugged. Many years ago, I was trained by Ford motor company to use a thin coating of petroleum jelly/vaseoline on seals as assembly lube when rebuilding automatic transmissions. Really helps prevent seal pinch and rolling too, but the main reason is, it melts to liquid once warm oil hits it. At this point it has protected everything from dry start up damage until oil takes over and has done its job without the plugging problem. Tranny Valve bodies have tiny oil passages that can plug too. If you place a jar of it in the sun @ 80 degrees you,ll find liquid. I have used it in hydralic cylinders too for the same reason. I understand you would want hydraulic oil on the metal parts as lube.

Enjoyed the detailed replys and knowledge. If you go to standard clutch with constant mesh transmission, you will have to stop each time to change directions or speed ranges. Grind, grind. Gets very tiresome by the end of the day. Plus if your pushing a load and bog down you lose all your momentem stopping to change to low. I think you redoing the reverser is a better idea. It is very frustrating to do the same repair over. But alot of experts have probably made every mistake twice along the way, that's how you learn and become an expert. Keep on going at it Ed.

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jdemaris

06-16-2004 19:34:52

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Re: Re: Re: JD 350 Reverser replacement in reply to Ed, 06-16-2004 13:23:36

I have seen that happen many times with reversers put together wrong. General joke about in the shop with "rebuilt" reversers was . . . either it won't make it one day, or it WILL last for years. I've seen quite a few that didn't last ten minutes. Main problem is the getting the bearings too tight. I don't believe the orifice in the shaft got plugged from grease. More likely the bearings were too tight, and the middle bearing is the weakest link being the smallest, and it got trashed. Unlike other types of gearboxes, the reverser bearing preload cannot be set by "hand" or "feel" for several reasons. One important reason being that there will always be sideplay in the imput shaft no matter how tight the bearings are. Some people assume that as long as there is sideplay, there is endplay. NOT TRUE. When the reverser is put together with either new or good bearings, a few shims should be added (temporarily) to the rear bearing quill to avoid the possibility of crushing the bearings. Then tighten everything up. Put the reverser upside down (with the input shaft pointing down). Get the case to rest on some wood blocks or equivalent so the end of the input shaft is not touching the floor. Then, take the pipe plug out of the rear bearing quill and put a dial indicator in it. Then, pry up on the input shaft from the floor while measuring endplay at teh rear with the dial indicator. It kind of a pain but it is the ONLY way to do it right. Get things set with .002"- .004" endplay and you'll be fine. I suspect the last person who rebuilt it had a heavy preload/crush on the bearings instead of end-play and that's all it takes to burn it up, quick. Especially the older 1010s and early 350s with the smaller center bearings. But, I've seen plenty of the later or updated ones with the larger bearings get trashed too. By the way, my 1010 has over 10,000 hours on it, it' never been apart, and it has the small center bearing assembly. Make sure your torsional isolator (or dampener plate) is okay, and make sure the reverser has good lube pressure when you get it going (stick a gauge in it).

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EdDavet

10-23-2004 18:20:18

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Re: Re: Re: Re: JD 350 Reverser replacement in reply to jdemaris, 06-16-2004 19:34:52

John,
Finished the rebuild as per your direction. Have about 40-50 hours on it with no problem!
Again I thank you for your input!
I intend to rebuild the final drives this winter and was wondering if you know of any clutch disks available for the 350 that will outlast the stock ones. The Deere fiber disks seem to self destruct over time with the condensate developing within the housing. I think someone mentioned a ceramic disc once but I can find no reference to it. If I go to the trouble to tear down the finals, I would like to put in something that will last awhile - We rebuilt the drives about 3 years ago and have about 200 hours on them and one side is starting to slip. Any info on the final clutches would be appreciated!
Thanks
Ed

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06-18-2004 11:26:13

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Re: Re: Re: Re: JD 350 Reverser replacement in reply to jdemaris, 06-16-2004 19:34:52

John,
Again, thank you for your reply!
I will set endplay as you suggest. Will also check torsional isolator. Although the book dosen't say much on what to look for on the isolator, I imagine just loose or worn parts. We did not check it on the last tear down.
Thanks again for your lernered help.
Ed

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