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Crawlers, Dozers, Loaders & Backhoes Discussion Forum

No power - No idea!

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Case 450

04-28-2005 16:43:22




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I have a loader and a backhoe. I recently purchased a Case 450 crawler loader. I have been using it in my pit for the last week for the first time. Now when I am pushing some dirt down the hill it will start pushing with lots of power fine but after about ten to twenty feet I can feel it losing power. The motor is still running strong but it's just not pushing. After about five or ten seconds it gets all it's power back. I know nothing about crawlers or how they work but I am prepared to listen and learn if someone can help me. Any ideas on where I can learn about these machines and any ideas on what my specific problem might be?

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Case 450

04-30-2005 17:21:12




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 Re: No power - No idea! in reply to Case 450 , 04-28-2005 16:43:22  
I checked out the machine lines under the seat and checked the filters and ended up finding the filters were extremely dirty. I am surprised that it ran for even a week. My only concern is that those clogged filters didn't suffocate any thing else. I changed out the filters and she runs like a top now. Want to thank you fellers for all the helpful advice. I am sure y'all will hear from me again in the future! lol!

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David in SC

04-30-2005 03:01:36




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 Re: No power - No idea! in reply to Case 450 , 04-28-2005 16:43:22  
Hi Case 450,
I do not know enough about these machines to diagnose your problem, but I can tell you where the filters/screens are located. There is a metal screen inside a housing located just off your charging pump. This is next to the starter and has a large suction hose to/from it and I believe supplies the torque converter. I think there is an O-ring seal so be prepared to replace after cleaning screen with solvent. There should also be a paper filter in the housing under your right arm as you are sitting on the machine. There is one for the hydraulics and one for the tranny in there. Follow the lines to see which one you need to check/replace. Case dealer or NAPA should have these filters. There is also a screen in the bottom of your hydraulic reservoir. Drain tank and pull off dipstick cover, reach in and unscrew it to remove and clean with solvent. That will not be your problem though, just as info.
You will probably need to remove belly pans to inspect your suction hoses that supply tranny. Not a bad job, though not fun either.

Disclaimer: I have a 450B so some of this may not be right for your machine, but I hope I have told you correctly.

Good luck,
David in SC

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seann

04-28-2005 19:16:06




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 Re: No power - No idea! in reply to Case 450 , 04-28-2005 16:43:22  
Offhand it sounds like it might be a transmission problem of some sort. For starters, check and make sure the transmission oil is up to level. And what does your transmission oil pressure gage read? It should have a green zone or something like that - is it ok? Does it fluctuate or drop when you lose power? Powershift machines have various filters that can become clogged and cause a loss in power. I'm not familiar with your machine, do you have a shop manual? You need to identify where the suction and safety filters are (often under the seat) and check them for clogging.

There are folks here who have these machines, hopefully someone can give you some more specific advice. Keep us posted...

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Case 450

04-29-2005 10:15:47




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 Re: No power - No idea! in reply to seann, 04-28-2005 19:16:06  
The machine's gauges have been mauled before I got it so no idea what the gauges oughta say. As for a shop manual, it didn't come with one when I bought it so I have ordered one from a local Case dealer (dang, and they aren't cheap either!) Once I find the filters, suction lines, and pick up's are I will check them and fluid levels this afternoon. Thanks for your advice Seann.



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seann

04-29-2005 12:18:14




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 Re: No power - No idea! in reply to Case 450, 04-29-2005 10:15:47  
In the meantime you should be able to find a cheap pressure gage at a plumbing supply or maybe an automotive store. I've seen gages used for measuring water pressure at a Lowes for less than ten bucks. A 0-300 psi gage should work well. My crawler (also with a powershift transmission) runs about 180 psi transmission oil pressure when it's up to speed. I believe the operating pressure for most powershift machines are on the order of this magnitude (although they also have regulated lower pressures internally as well). So if you hook it up and see something like 50 psi and it fluctuates, that will tell you right there you have a problem (anything from a bad pump, bad seals, clogged filters, low oil level etc).

Also check for contamination in your transmission oil...make sure it doesn't have water (looks milky) or dirt in it. It should be clean, clear and not be black or sooty.

There should also be a replaceable paper cartridge transmission oil filter (in addition to the suction and safety filters). You might want to check and/or replace that while you're at it as well (I got mine at NAPA for about $20).

Good luck

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Applegate

05-21-2005 18:19:50




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 Re: No power - No idea! in reply to seann, 04-29-2005 12:18:14  
My 450 had the same problem. After cleaning the suction screen, temporarily removing the high pressure filter, and removing the charge pump to verify that it was OK I found out that the trans oil was the problem. Not only was it black and thick but someone(me) had been adding Hydraulic instead of TCH fluid. Under that set of conditions the poor charge pump could not draw the fluid out of the sump.
After a complete transfusion I get 180 to 200 psi on the trans pressure guage.

BTW: grease is good ... more grease is better

Did you know that you have to occasionally grease the front idlers. I just spent the better part of a whole day extracting the badly mangled remnant of one idler shaft and am looking at about $350 in parts to repair it.

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