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Crawlers, Dozers, Loaders & Backhoes Discussion Forum

72 yale 353 dertroit..re info from N C wayne

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mike janice

11-07-2005 12:31:40

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will be waiting thanks N C wayne

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NC Wayne

11-07-2005 22:49:11

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Re: 72 yale 353 dertroit..re info from N C wayne in reply to mike janice, 11-07-2005 12:31:40

Hey Mike, I ran your problem by a couple other Detroit guys today and they all say pretty much the same thing. If it was running fine before you changed the filters and isn't now something had to have happened when you changed the filter to cause the problem. The consenses, unfortunately, is pretty much what I said in the beginning, it sounds like it's sucking air from somewhere. The usual culprit for this happening is the gasket on the filter canisters. It's really easy to pinch one of them when putting the canister back in place or possibly the gasket managed to drop completely out and you somehow missed it. We've all been there a time or two on both counts so it's a common problem. Basically you wind up with either a hole where the seal ring got cut/pinched or a not so good metal to metal "seal". If the tank is below the level of the filter housings your not likely to notice any fuel leakage but the fuel pump, being a positive displacement type, is sure to suck air. I wish I could give you a 100% positive answer to your problem, but without actually being there to look things over that's hard to do in a situation like this. The best advice I can give you right now is to pull the filters back off and check everything out really good. Make sure not only the large seal ring is OK but also the one around the bolt that pulls the canister up tight. Make sure the filters haven't somehow gotten clogged (not likely I know but I've seen stranger things happen). The other week I checked on a problem on a crane. They told me they had changed the fuel filters (plural here meaning both). Since I saw one back at the engine was new I took their word for it and looked for other problems without finding anything. When they called back the next week with the same problem I started looking "from scratch" and found they hadn't changed the primary filter, just the secondary one I had seen the week before. I changed the one other filter and the problem went away. My point is don't assume anything. You may know for a fact you did everything right but often times if you second check yourself, you'll find that one small thing that slipped by you that's causing the problem. If you check everything out a second time and find everything is perfect thenright at the moment I honestly don't know what else to tell you. Check everything out and let me know what you find and we'll take it from there. Good luck. Wayne

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m janice

11-20-2005 21:59:58

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Re: N C wayne 72 backhoe in reply to NC Wayne, 11-07-2005 22:49:11

Hey Wayne,
Just wanted to shout out to you that after I had someone stop over and myself looking over it,, we had seen some air bubbles in the fuel line ,,hence the stopping and going of the rpm,, after tefloning all the fittings and tighting the clamps etc,,, no air bubbles ,,guess what runs great,, thanks for everything ..M Janice

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mike janice

11-09-2005 17:14:49

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Re: 72 yale 353 dertroit..re info from N C wayne in reply to NC Wayne, 11-07-2005 22:49:11

Thanks wayne I will try it,,just a note it started to run unevenly before I changed the filters almost the same time I added some diesel conditioner and or stuff for clearing up any water in fuel..Thats what made me look at the filters and change them,,I was pretty careful making sure not to pinch or have them drop out,but you are right its easy for it to do,,should I really take the plug out of the top of the primary and secondary filter and fill with fuel,,wont the intake of fuel dissipate all the air in the lines after a little bit of running??.

just curious thanks M janice

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NC Wayne

11-09-2005 19:22:10

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Re: 72 yale 353 dertroit..re info from N C wayne in reply to mike janice, 11-09-2005 17:14:49

As far as topping the filters off through the plug that was straight out of the manual. Now I'm not gonna say I haven't changed a set without "topping them off" myself because I have. A there have been times I've done it without pulling the plug because the plug wouldn't come out or whatever. If that happens I usually kept the fuel shut off /shutdown pulled and spin the engine over for a minute or two to flush any remaining air out and finish priming the system. Usually this is sufficient but there have been a couple through the years that were stubborn and I had to start over reprime everything. Usually though I'm also dealing with at least a 6 cylinder engine so it has a little more fuel remaining in the system after the change to run on. With the extra cylinders even if one or two catch an air bubble it might stutter but it'll keep running. With a three cylinder there's just no "extras" when two catching a bubble at the same time...and she won't run on just one... Now onto what you said about it running rough. Based on that information you probably have at least one or more injectors bad. When I say bad I mean the tips are carboned up closing off one or more of the holes in the nozzles, or it could also be just the opposite and the holes are worn enough that their squirting the fuel instead of atomizing it. Either problem will make it hard to start and it won't run right. Based on everything you'ver told me so far that seems more likely than something like one of the injectors being stuck. Usually if one sticks it'll only run at, up to, or come down to, a specific RPM, and that doesn't sound anything like what your describing. Next question, how are you filling the tank, a bucket at the time or out of a bulk tank? What I'm getting at is you might have just gotten some bad fuel. I've worked on several over the years that had gotten bad fuel and started giving problems. Something else you might want to check, and I haven't said anything before now because, yes, I assumed the tank was mounted below the filters is the fuel shutoff on the tank. I have seen them where you shut the valve off and when you turn it back on the handle moves but the valve doesn't open all the way. Too their could possibly be a strainer in the tank on the suction line that has gotten clogged. To check all of this at the same time disconnect the suction line and hook up another one and let it draw out of a bucket of clean fuel. If everything clears up then you know for sure there'as something wrong on the suction side. If the problem persists then I'd be pulling the injectors and checking them. if you decide to do that let me know what the number and color on the injector tag is and I can tell you what to time them back at. it's easiest to use the proper tool but you can do it with a dial caliper with a depth guage just as easy if you've got enough room over the top of the engine. If you do pull them you can check the spray pattern by holding the injector in you hand by the barrel and hitting the top of it with a soft faced mallet. Just be dang sure not to get your fingers near the tip when you do this because it can inject fuel through your skin, and that is not a good thing. Let me know what you find. If you have any other questions, etc and want to write me direct my email is Nota55Nomad@AOL.com Good luck.

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m janice

11-13-2005 22:53:14

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Re: 72 yale 353 dertroit..re info from N C wayne in reply to NC Wayne, 11-09-2005 19:22:10

Thanks again my friend ,I will do that asap you have been very helpful and patience and knowlegable to say the least.. Thanks again
I will email you just to at least inform you of the circumstances,,dont wnat to wear out my welcome.. Thanks M janice

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