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Crawlers, Dozers, Loaders & Backhoes Discussion Forum

JD 450c speed of shift

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drk

12-03-2005 08:18:30




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took my 450c to a local mechanic to get steering clutches and other work done on it. Everything is fixed except the speed of shift. It is so fast that if it does'nt break my neck it is going to tear up the dozer.He claims that everything is adjusted according to the book. Is it that he does'nt know what he is talking about or could there be something else wrong?




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seann

12-03-2005 14:31:35




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 Re: JD 450c speed of shift in reply to drk, 12-03-2005 08:18:30  
Might be the idle is set too high, causing the converter to transfer torque/power during your shifts.



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jdemaris

12-03-2005 14:59:09




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 Re: JD 450c speed of shift in reply to seann, 12-03-2005 14:31:35  
450C doesn't have a torque-converter. It's driven by a conventional dry engine clutch and hydraulically activated clutches in the HL-R tranmission. When it's working right, you should be able to shift from High - Low - or Reverse at full throttle - without breaking your neck. Usually, harsh rate-of-shift problems are caused by the adjuster nut coming loose on the linkage rod that connects the foot clutch pedal to the hydraulic regulating valve. It's under a rubber plug by your right foot. Usually there's either one 5/16" lock nut, or, often two 5/16" nuts jammed against each other.

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Roy Suomi

12-03-2005 21:41:58




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 Re: JD 450c speed of shift in reply to jdemaris, 12-03-2005 14:59:09  
Speed of shift is a relativley easy adjustment. Pull the left floorboard out. There is a rubber plug there. pop the plug out and you will find a 5/16" nut on a threaded rod sticking straight upright. I use a 3/8 ratchet with a 1/2" deep socket on a short extension. To do it right you will need to put a guage into the pressure tap hole. This is located between the steering levers on the cast top cover. There will be a " drum bung " there . remove the bung plug. Inside you will find a 1/8" pipe plug with a 3/16 allen head.I use a dab of grease on the allen when removing the plug. This plug is on an angle, pointing forward. Install a guage with a 1/8 nipple . A 250 lb guage will work fine.Adjust the pedal free-play to about 4 1/4" from top of pedal to where the throw out bearing just touches the clutch fingers. Put the 4 speed into the neutral position between 3rd and 4th gears.Lock the brakes down.Start the machine, ease out the clutch pedal to make sure the 4 speed is in neutral. You can now start adjusting the HLR speed of shift. I usually back off the adjustment till the pressure drops off a bit. Then I turn the adjustment in till the pressure goes to maximum psi. Turn it a bit more till the pressure just starts to drop off [ 5 to 10 lbs ]. You will be real close now. Try the speed of shift with the 4 speed still in neutral at about 1/2 throttle. The guage will show a lag between high and reverse . when you have it close, put the 4speed into 2nd gear and try it out. If it's still fast, turn the adjustment in 1/4 turn at a time till it's comfortable. It should just suck you out of the seat slightly going high to reverse . don't make it too " lazy " or too slow. This could cause overheating because of slippage. If it's too slow back off the adjustment 1/4 turn at a time. Usually when it's adjusted right, you can push the clutch pedal down 1/2" and the pressure guage will show a slight increase in pressure . The book can be a little intimidating . Go with the above and you should be OK. If you don't feel confident doing it yourself , print this page and take it to your mechanic. Oh , the pressure should read 175 to 185 lbs. . If after doing adjustments the pressure isn't up to snuff, under the right floorboard is a rubber plug. Under the plug you will find a cap of the pressure control valve.[ A penny is good for about 12 to 15 lbs.]

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Roy Suomi

12-10-2005 21:00:48




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 Re: JD 450c speed of shift in reply to Roy Suomi, 12-03-2005 21:41:58  
OK , there is an adjustment on the side of the transmission case, that you don't usually have to touch.It's on the brake pedal side. You will notice a square head plug about 2 inches from the top cover joint , just under the hourmeter plate. If you take out the plug there is a needle valve and a jam nut in there, I use an 11/16 deep socket and a short screw driver to adjust it. I have a special socket with a roll pin driven into the hole in the socket so I can turn the jam nut without disturbing the needle valve adjustment. Turn the needle valve in 1/4 turn at a time . It's kind of a bugger to get to, but it's the only other thing to do about aggressive shifts..Sorry about not getting back sooner, but I work full time for a road dept in the snow belt.I usually put about 64 miles on my Mack truck just plowing my route one time .

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drk

12-11-2005 16:33:55




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 Re: JD 450c speed of shift in reply to Roy Suomi, 12-10-2005 21:00:48  
Roy. I tried that before I took the clutch accumulator out and went through it. The book says that if you can screw the needle valve in all the way and there is no difference in the speed of shift that you should check the screen, ball valve, and the orfice at the screen. I removed the needle valve and there were signs that it had been screwed in to tight at one time. I cleaned the burrs of the needle valve and put every thing back together. It still shifts to hard. I noticed that the book says that the pressure should go up about 5 pounds when you depress the clutch about half an inch. The pressure of mine goes down as soon as you depress the clutch. We don't get much snow down here in Texas thank goodness. Thanks for your help.

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Roy Suomi

12-11-2005 19:51:45




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 Re: JD 450c speed of shift in reply to drk, 12-11-2005 16:33:55  
When adjusting the HLR thru clutch housing , as I stated turn it down till the pressure drops off slightly. Did you do that? When it is adjusted this way it should increase presure when clutch pedal is slightly depressed. I've seen some actually lower the clutch pedal when adjusting the speed of shift. Usually what is wrong there is the clutch linkage on the side of clutch housing is rusted stuck. If you study the linkage there is an adjuster to adjust clutch pedal free-play. When you back it off it should change the free-play on the pedal.If it doesn't , chances are the linkage is stuck.This adjustment is a 1/2" bolt next to the pedal[ 3/4" wrench]. If you back it off it should not make the bolt raise from it's seat.If it raises , the linkage is frozen on the shaft it pivots on..

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drk

12-12-2005 16:22:46




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 Re: JD 450c speed of shift in reply to Roy Suomi, 12-11-2005 19:51:45  
Roy, I adjusted the pressure until it started to come down, but when I pushed in the clutch one half inch the pressure would drop. I did'nt read your latest solution until tonight, and I will check out what you said to do tomorrow. Thanks again for your help and time. Donald



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drk

12-04-2005 17:15:37




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 Re: JD 450c speed of shift in reply to Roy Suomi, 12-03-2005 21:41:58  
Thanks for your help. I have been out of town for a couple of weeks.Tomorrow I"m going to go see if the guy working on my dozer has done any good. If it is still the same I"ll go ahead and take it home and work on it myself.Thanks again for your help and information, I will let you know how it turns out.



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drk

12-06-2005 16:04:08




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 Re: JD 450c speed of shift in reply to drk, 12-04-2005 17:15:37  
Got my dozer back. It still shifts too fast. Tried adjusting it to your and the John Deere tech manual specs but still shifted too fast.The tech manual said that if you could not get the speed of shift adjusted to take the accumulator out and check the screen ,valves,and orifices for blockages. I did this and found none. If anyone has an idea of what is wrong, I would appreaciate hearing from you. thanks

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