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Crawlers, Dozers, Loaders & Backhoes Discussion Forum

chargeing pump on case 450b

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Roney McStotts

11-18-2006 15:03:42




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When I took the screen apart on the suction line how much fluid should be in the container I did not get much out .I put a window on the out put line and did not see any flow of fluid . I am looking for a suction leak but have not found it yet. The hose at the transmission is swollen so I don't know if its there. If I take it off common sense tells me all the fluid in the transmission will pour out on me and then the ground stuff is expensive to waste. how can one prime the chargeing pump. I don't know if I have transmission problems or chargeing pump problems. I don't have any transmission pressure and am trying to figure out where the problem is . will transmission problems cause the trans pressure to be to low to register. I finialy got the bottom plate off the transmission to get to the lower suction line. When I had trans pressure last I could move the machine Service manual does't say much just install a pump and run engine but if it is full of air will it suck hard enough to prime itself. I got bearing parts from the screen but never heard any noise. Took the screen out today and found no new metal . hopeful tomorrow I can get the brakes off and check the pinon gear for movement Does anyone have any susjestions . on what to look for. This is my first dozer and will learn a lot from it. First thing I have learned is that the bolts are hard to take off and everything is heavey as all get out.

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Case450

11-29-2006 18:19:27




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 Re: charging pump on case 450b in reply to Roney McStotts, 11-18-2006 15:03:42  
I had a problem with my machine too when i first bought it. Mine wouldnt move. A fella from down south helped out. I had a bunch of junk in the fluid (previous owner didnt' do any maintenance on the machine at all) so after I changed out the fluid and cleaned up everything i could get at my tranny would charge but not enough to hold a run. After getting my buddy to run the machine I noticed that the suction hose was collapsing and not allowing fluid to charge. I replaced the hose with suction hose (that other guy is right, the mesh is a pain to clamp) and I've been running good for two years now. I rebuilt my undercarriage this summer and will be replacing the entire exhaust system soon with electrical to follow.

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roney mcstotts

11-22-2006 02:57:50




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 Re: chargeing pump on case 450b in reply to Roney McStotts, 11-18-2006 15:03:42  
where can I find parts for the chargeing pump the place I called was very pricey. If I need the bearnings can I get them machined . This might be cheaper than the price they wanted .I have looked on line but have not been able to find a place to get them. I haven't taken the pump apart yet but need to know where to get the parts that I will need.



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roney mcstotts

11-19-2006 13:06:45




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 Re: chargeing pump on case 450b in reply to Roney McStotts, 11-18-2006 15:03:42  
removed suction line, hose is old and cracked. put plug in suction line on transmission. put fluid in transmission. kept out about 1 gal run line from chargeing pump into fluid. would not suck fluid up. primed line with small pump would suck but when disconected pump from line would not pump. did get air to back flow in fluid. .Should the pump have picked up fluid in bucket and sent to transmission? Is my pump bad. will replace rubber hose tomorrow maybe . will test again and see if I get trans pressure

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roney mcstotts

11-19-2006 07:00:04




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 Re: chargeing pump on case 450b in reply to Roney McStotts, 11-18-2006 15:03:42  
drained transmission found no metal in fluid swept magtnet inside tranmission pulled out no metal. unless all was sucked up by pump where else could it come from unless it was left inside the suction line from previous repairs. Would the suction pump suck up all metal parts and flakes. I find that unlikely will change suction hoses first and check for metal parts inside them. Is the hose reinforced to prevent colasping from suction

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alrman

11-18-2006 17:36:06




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 Re: chargeing pump on case 450b in reply to Roney McStotts, 11-18-2006 15:03:42  
hello Roney,
1)you shouldn't get too much oil out of the screen as it will drain back to trans.

2)yes, oil will pour out if you remove suction hose - try carefully draining oil into a clean 20lt (4gal) drum - then change all hoses & then simply refill trans with oil you removed - if it looks dirty, change it!If that doesn't fix your cavitation remove your pump & check it out.That will be your problem.
(Also, if anything is coming apart in the transmission you will find debris in bottom of it - run a magnet around inside drain hole & your drum you use to catch the oil in.)

3)Dont pull your brakes apart just to check pinions - it is an awkward job & you dont want to do it for no reason.You will know if bearings are gone as it will make ugly noises when you move machine.
good luck!

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roney mcstotts

11-19-2006 02:01:35




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 Re: chargeing pump on case 450b in reply to alrman, 11-18-2006 17:36:06  
I need to take the right break off as it is not working. I had the hydralics working on it so its internal. I never did use them much. I didn't hear noies from the transmission when I moved it last time. If I cleared the tracks from the ground and turned them manunaly would I hear noies then . It look like the ripper is suspose to be welded to the clamps so should I weld them back .All I have to do is remove the front bolts to have them off. Thanks a lot I will try and drain the transmission today.

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alrman

11-19-2006 13:48:50




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 Re: chargeing pump on case 450b in reply to roney mcstotts, 11-19-2006 02:01:35  
re:suction hose - oil delivery hose is all you need to use - dont use anything with wire reinforcing - it dosen't seal as well as the delivery hose



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alrman

11-19-2006 13:39:58




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 Re: chargeing pump on case 450b in reply to roney mcstotts, 11-19-2006 02:01:35  
It looks like your pump is suspect.The only metal that can contaminate it must pass through the suction screen which should be 100 micron (from memory).Make sure there are no holes in it.
Charge pump has alloy bearing blocks that turn into each other over many hours of work - this causes them to suck air through the front seal. The only way to check this is by removing the pump & stripping it - You should be able to buy parts required to repair it,but if the body is too badly worn around the gear area they are a throw away - buy new one.

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