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Crawlers, Dozers, Loaders & Backhoes Discussion Forum

Cat 4cylinder No 2 cylinder not firing

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mocus

02-28-2007 10:59:46




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Have a 933 cat. Govenor broke and caused engine to overrev breifly before it quit. Have repaired replaced govenor and pump asembly. Since repair, no 2 cylinder is not firing. Checked pump injector timing. Replaced no 2 injector. Pump is pumping at no 2 line at injector. Compression reads around 300 pounds in that cylinder basd on a sort of rigged up compression tester that did not seal perfectly tight. Valves all appear to be working and fully closed as required. Push rod does not appear to be bent although they have not been removed. Anybody have any suggestions on what to look for before I remove head.

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Old Magnet

02-28-2007 20:35:00




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 Re: Cat 4cylinder No 2 cylinder not firing in reply to mocus, 02-28-2007 10:59:46  
Which model 933 is it??



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mocus

03-01-2007 09:08:13




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 Re: Cat 4cylinder No 2 cylinder not firing in reply to Old Magnet, 02-28-2007 20:35:00  
Model 11A 3588

Highlift, pony start



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Bob Plumadore

02-28-2007 18:51:46




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 Re: Cat 4cylinder No 2 cylinder not firing in reply to mocus, 02-28-2007 10:59:46  
300 PSI is not enough to fire the fuel
it souds like a bent valve.



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Bob/Ont

02-28-2007 18:02:58




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 Re: Cat 4cylinder No 2 cylinder not firing in reply to mocus, 02-28-2007 10:59:46  
What is coming out of exh??? A white puff that goes away when you crack the fuel line is fuel not fireing. Did you zero rack when you put the plunger into #2?
Later Bob



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mocus

03-01-2007 09:11:36




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 Re: Cat 4cylinder No 2 cylinder not firing in reply to Bob/Ont, 02-28-2007 18:02:58  
Not sure what is meant by sero rack, but the tooth on th plunger had a bump that lined up with line on rack for all 4 pumps, and it is set like the other 3.



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RAB

02-28-2007 13:44:36




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 Re: Cat 4cylinder No 2 cylinder not firing in reply to mocus, 02-28-2007 10:59:46  
Busted valve spring? bent valve?
Do a compressed air test to see if/where the air leaks.
New injectors may sometimes be faulty - unlikely to get two failing like this.
Compare cylinder pressures - means sealing them properly.
A few suggestions here, but sounds likely they will be no use unless just a broken spring as head will need to come off, me thinks. All assuming repairs were done properly? Does nozzle spray when injector is connected and tested out of head?(safety!!- take great care with high pressure fuel spray!!)
Regards, RAB

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mocus

03-01-2007 09:17:14




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 Re: Cat 4cylinder No 2 cylinder not firing in reply to RAB, 02-28-2007 13:44:36  
We've tried other injectors, so assume it is not that. Fuel is squirting out good when we bleed it. Valve spring is not broken that we can tell. I've talked to some who say 300 lbs is enough compression and others say it is not. Hope it is not a piston / rod problem. The pump is pumping, it has good pressure. The other 3 cylinders are running correctly. White smoke is puffing due to miss. We should check other cylinder pressures. Head will have to come off It appears Thanks for help

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Old Magnet

03-01-2007 09:41:53




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 Re: Cat 4cylinder No 2 cylinder not firing in reply to mocus, 03-01-2007 09:17:14  
Fuel squirting good is not a test.
Breaking pressures...New 700 psi, good 600 psi, bad 550 psi. The only way to check other than swapping injector nozzles and pumps is to have them tested.

Cat does not utilize compression tests, only air leak down tests but I have checked a few and found 425 psi...real good, 400 psi...OK, 375 psi or less....poor with white smoke.

Severe over speed may cause piston to kiss valve and/or bend push rods. I'd still do some more injection checking before going in there. The leak down test would verify valve seating which you should be able to hear if it is spitting. May be a case of shot rings in that cylinder.

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mocus

03-02-2007 14:07:05




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 Re: Cat 4cylinder No 2 cylinder not firing in reply to Old Magnet, 03-01-2007 09:41:53  
This thing ran good prior to this problem. used NO oil. never got hot. I'd be suprised if it wrer rings. I have spare plunger/pump I could stick on # 2 to test. If not the WE have whtite smoke. It think air test is next. Thanks for help



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Old Magnet

03-02-2007 17:23:53




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 Re: Cat 4cylinder No 2 cylinder not firing in reply to mocus, 03-02-2007 14:07:05  
Forgot to mention...broken rings can also be the result of an over reved engine. Especially with a worn engine that has a generous ring wear lip at the top of the cylinder. Doesn't necessarily effect all cylinders when it happens. Keep us posted with your results. Good luck.



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Old Magnet

02-28-2007 13:43:30




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 Re: Cat 4cylinder No 2 cylinder not firing in reply to mocus, 02-28-2007 10:59:46  
The usual check is to move the injector and then the individual injector pump to another cylinder to see if the problem travels to the new location. Install at least one cylinder away from existing location.
Then you know for sure whether or not it is the injection equipment.



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RAB

03-01-2007 08:02:49




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 Re: Cat 4cylinder No 2 cylinder not firing in reply to Old Magnet, 02-28-2007 13:43:30  
Forgive me for pointing out, but that only checks out the injector - in this case if it seems it could be the injection pump or the cylinder.
Regards, RAB



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