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Crawlers, Dozers, Loaders & Backhoes Discussion Forum

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jdemaris

10-28-2007 07:04:55




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Forgot to mention, the early 450s have the HL-R shifter down on the floor, later it is up on a side-box.




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jim48

10-28-2007 07:37:46




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 Re: One more comment in reply to jdemaris, 10-28-2007 07:04:55  
My mistake, I meant to say wet clutch..must of had tractors on my mind. Thanks for your help.



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jim48

10-28-2007 09:15:43




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 dozer won't shift out of reverse in reply to jim48, 10-28-2007 07:37:46  
I just drove the dozer. It did fine until it got warmed up, then it would only go in reverse. Does it need a transmission?



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jdemaris

10-28-2007 10:40:05




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 Re: dozer won't shift out of reverse in reply to jim48, 10-28-2007 09:15:43  
First of all, it this crawler has wet-steering clutches, it has to be a "C" or newer. The B series - 350 or 450 - all had dry clutches.

If this is a 450C - and it has the HL-R hydraulic-shift transmission - coupled to a four-speed gear/range transmission - and you lose reverse in the HL-R when hot - walk away from it unless it's really cheap. You could easily spend $5000 getting it fixed. If the sellers tells you it's a "simple problem" - then tell him "good" - and to fix it before you buy it.

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jim48

10-28-2007 15:09:47




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 Re: dozer won't shift out of reverse in reply to jdemaris, 10-28-2007 10:40:05  
It had reverse. When I drove it and it got warmed up, I put it in reverse and when I tried to go forward again, it wouldn't go. All I had was reverse, no forward movement, so I just backed it up and parked it.



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jim48

10-28-2007 15:56:03




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 one more comment in reply to jim48, 10-28-2007 15:09:47  
I can't walk away from it, I own it...not one of my smarter moves, but I bought it at an auction. I don't know if it has a wet clutch or not, a friend of mine told me he thought it did..I'm absolutely new to dozers..never drove one until I bought this one, just wanted to clean my farm up with it. HL-R is on the floor, and drive 1234 is on the side. I know it is a 4 cylinder diesel, so that makes it a 450. The numbers on the the motor are T24961. I know I'm confusing you, but I do appreciate your help. If it doesn't have a wet clutch, is it something that can be fixed reasonably...less than $5,000? Thanks again.

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jdemaris

10-28-2007 17:31:37




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 Re: one more comment in reply to jim48, 10-28-2007 15:56:03  
T24961 is the earliest diesel ever used in the 450 or 2510 ag. tractor - it's a 202. Sounds like a 1966 crawler.

The HL-R trans is very rugged - but like anything else, it will wear out - and your's is over 40 years old. Parts for it have gotten incredibly expensive. So, often - when they start to slip - they go to auction. Especially early 450s since they aren't very powerful and not worth as much as the later versions. A late 450B 239 turbo will run circles around an early 450 with a non-turbo 202. Nice thing - for the sellers is - they usually work cold and don't start slipping or not-moving at all until hot. Same with the engine. That engine uses a pair of balancing shafts that often don't get fixed during normal "in-frame" engine rebuilds. When they get worn, and engine has great oil pressure cold - and gradually gets lower as it gets hot - sometimes down to zero at engine-idle. I had a chance to buy a 450 last month - with a winch and a 6-way dozer. The guy wanted $2800 - which normally would be a steal. But, he was also honest and told me that once it's hot - it won't move. I passed it up. Even doing all the work myself I could of spent well over $3000 on the trans - and who knows what else? That would make it a $5800 machine - if I assume all my labor is worth nothing. I'm not trying to make you feel bad - just telling you like it is. I hope you did't pay more than $2000 for it. If so - the only way out - is to send it to auction again - or - take it apart yourself and hope to get lucky.

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jim48

10-28-2007 18:42:30




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 Re: one more comment in reply to jdemaris, 10-28-2007 17:31:37  
Thanks for your help.



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