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Just making sure i undrestand,

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Bryce Andreasen

12-03-2002 19:27:06




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From all of your advice, i have gathered that to change a 6 volt to a 12 volt system you have to change a few things. One person says that you could put a voltage regulator on the six volt generator. One says that a six volt starter will work just fine on a 12 volt system. Of course the lights will have to be changed. I read that you have to put a warning light on the alternator? I have an H already without one and it works just fine? Maybe I'm just confused? How would you change the mag on the engine?

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casered

12-04-2002 20:50:21




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 Re: just making sure i undrestand, in reply to Bryce Andreasen, 12-03-2002 19:27:06  
John Ne said about changing the ammeter if neccasary. It reminded me where I read about taking the ammeter off and putting in a voltmeter instead. I have never personally done this on any of my conversions, it just made me think of it. All this talk makes me think about people that don't think this can be done. I have talked to many people that think you have too cut the hood out on letter series farmalls to fit the alternator in there. They can't believe it will work until you show them it is in there behind the hood. Anybody else ever take their tractor to a show and have a skeptic say anything similar. Just curious. Have a good one.

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Tim Malin

12-04-2002 17:48:55




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 Re: just making sure i undrestand, in reply to Bryce Andreasen, 12-03-2002 19:27:06  
Although I do not know when the conversion was made, i have a 1953 Super M I bought at auction with 12 volt. On the day I was taking it home, pulling out into a State Highway with everyone going 60 mph, i tried to beat the car coming up the hill at least to the other side of the road so I could be on my way, and I didn't give it enough fuel while trying to steer (no PS) with one hand and shift with the other. It killed in the middle of the road. To not increase imbarassment, i calmly hit the starter to hear a "whimming" sound down on my left by the flywheel. i knew exactly what it was. I put it in nuetral and squatted below the axle, hugging it up to my neck, and somehow pulled it out of the road. I was able to roll start it with the instant help from about 5 volunteers, but it was later diagnosed as a 6V starter on a 12V system. The most respected IH mechanic in this region, including the dealerships, is an independent guy, who told me a 6V will eventually give up because it's not designed for the starting torque forced through it. It may have been like that for 20, 30, or even 40 years, but decided to go out. If you asked me back then, I would have said no way to a 12V conversion without converting your starter, but today, I think you can go ahead and do it becuase either way it will cost you the same. It's simply opinion whether you have the time and money now to do it or save some money and just let it go until it needs to be converted. My next tractor, if it has 6V, i'm not going to monkey with the starter. Good luck on your projects.

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Bob M

12-04-2002 06:01:45




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 Re: just making sure i undrestand, in reply to Bryce Andreasen, 12-03-2002 19:27:06  
Bryce - Here's answers to a few of your questions:

One person says that you could put a voltage regulator on the six volt generator. YES - that can work. However the generator must be spun faster for it to develop 12 volts. Means if you idle or run slow a lot, the battery will not be charged.

One says that a six volt starter will work just fine on a 12 volt system. YES! Conversions I did 20+ years ago are still starting fine on the original 6 volt starters.

I read that you have to put a warning light on the alternator? I have an H already without one and it works just fine? YES and NO! A "3-wire" alternator needs either a lamp, resistor or diode in the #1 control line for it to work. A "1-wire" alternator however needs no auxiliary components.

How would you change the mag on the engine? DON'T NEED TO!. A magneto is totally independent of the charging system - it doesn't care whether the system is 6 volt, 12 volt or doesn't exist.

Hope this helps! ...Bob M

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gene b

12-04-2002 04:15:30




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 Re: just making sure i undrestand, in reply to Bryce Andreasen, 12-03-2002 19:27:06  
Leave the mag alone it does not use power from a battery. Put some new 1ga cables on your new 625 6v battery and you probably will be ok these started for many many years on 6v. Mite even need a rebuilt starter. You dont go to 24v when your car doesent start do you?



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Doug in OR

12-03-2002 20:57:02




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 Re: just making sure i undrestand, in reply to Bryce Andreasen, 12-03-2002 19:27:06  
Click on "Articles" under "Research & Info" on the left side of this web page. If you look down the list of topics, you will find one devoted to "Changing from 6 to 12 Volts". The info you need will be there. You don't need a warning light with an alternator, but you should use a resistor and diode if you don't use the light. As another said, you can use a single wire alternator and not need either a resistor or warning light. The disadvantage to single wire systems is that they usually need more RPM to start charging. With an older tractor, RPM is something that just isn't there.

The only thing reusable with a 12 volt system is the starter and ammeter. You need to add a resistor to your coil, if you are using battery ignition.

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John Ne.

12-03-2002 21:21:03




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 Re: Re: just making sure i undrestand, in reply to Doug in OR, 12-03-2002 20:57:02  
I'd even watch the ammeter, for the six volt system it probably only reads 15 or 20 amperes, most alternators put out from 65 to 120 amperes, if its pegged all the time, get a modern one, it'll bolt in the hole. John in Nebr.



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Bryce Andreasen

12-04-2002 19:24:01




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 Re: Re: Re: just making sure i undrestand, in reply to John Ne., 12-03-2002 21:21:03  
Doug, what part of NE do you live in? I live Near Blair, NE



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Doug in OR

12-06-2002 10:57:47




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: just making sure i undrestand, in reply to Bryce Andreasen, 12-04-2002 19:24:01  
I live in Oregon. I presume you meant John. Not that I am unfamiliar with Nebraska... lived in Columbus for 15 years.. and Omaha for another 7 years. And then there was those 3 years when I was stationed at Offutt. But I originally hark back to Wisconsin for my farm upbringing. Opps.. I'm dating myself now. Have a good one.



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scottAR

12-03-2002 20:34:03




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 Re: just making sure i undrestand, in reply to Bryce Andreasen, 12-03-2002 19:27:06  
Someone posted here a couple of months back about putting a 12 volt regulator on a 6 volt generator. I've never done it but it must work because they gave very detailed instructions on how to do it. I do know the 6 volt starter will work for quite some time because I changed my M to 12 volt in 1976 and the 6 volt starter is still on it today



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CNKS

12-03-2002 19:52:18




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 Re: just making sure i undrestand, in reply to Bryce Andreasen, 12-03-2002 19:27:06  
I prefer to leave it 6 volt. However, I can answer a couple of your questions. 6 volt starter is fine. I had my H out of time a couple of years ago and cranked and cranked over a period of about a week before I found the problem, starter is still good, don't be concerned about it. Mag is completely separate from either 6 or 12 volt, you don't need to do anything. -- You have a mag on a 400? Distributer was standard, I guess mag was still optional. If you don't want to use an alternator, the generator can be changed to 12 volt, but it's more than just the regulator, someone else will have to tell you how to do it.

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CNKS

12-03-2002 19:55:15




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 Re: Re: just making sure i undrestand, in reply to CNKS, 12-03-2002 19:52:18  
Forgot to say, I bought the H with a non-working 6 volt system and a mag, never converted it to 12 volt,just use a 12 volt battery to start it with, generator is not hooked up.



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Dave_D

12-04-2002 13:36:57




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 Re: Re: Re: just making sure i undrestand, in reply to CNKS, 12-03-2002 19:55:15  
I got a B that setup the same way. I just use the 12 volts to start the tractor (It has no lights). I just use a battery charger now a then. There generator is just on there to keep the belt tight. :)

- Dave



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jim

12-03-2002 19:42:24




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 Re: just making sure i undrestand, in reply to Bryce Andreasen, 12-03-2002 19:27:06  
You can put a 12 volt Delco "one wire" alternator on any older tractor and it will work great, but you do need to watch the pulley size on the alternator. If it is very big you won't get much of a charge at idle speed. The 6 volt starter will work ok as long as you don't crank too long on it at any one time (which you shouldn't have to after the conversion). The magnetos don't make any difference because they don't use the battery for ignition. The make their own spark. You will need to change any light bulbs to 12 volt or they will burn out very quickly. If you have a coil ignition just change over to a 12 volt coil with a built in resistor so it won't burn up the points.

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