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Why Buy Overbore Sleeves and Pistons

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Brian Schmidt

12-11-1999 22:08:37




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I understand why you would overbore an engine that didn’t have sleeves. You need to cleanup the cylinder walls. But in a Farmall engine with sleeves, why would one elect to put in overbore pistons and sleeves? Seems like you are asking for trouble with wall flex and overheating. For the little power you gain it seems risky. Am I all wet or what?

I have yet to rebuild my Farmall C engine. One of these days it will surely need it and would like to know as much as possible first. If one really gains much and does not cause any problems, should I put in an overbore kit from a Super C. The Super C already has a larger bore with the same block as the C. This would give me almost another 20 cubes. Then, with fire crater pistons, what kind of horsepower increase should I get? Will all this give me cooling problems?

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big fred

12-12-1999 11:22:40




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 Re: Why Buy Overbore Sleeves and Pistons in reply to Brian Schmidt, 12-11-1999 22:08:37  
Not all of the C had a water pump,(I think all the Super C did) so adding one might make you feel better about the overbore kit, as it would take care of any cooling problems. I understand you need a different upper radiator hose fitting also, for the thermostat.



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Bill Brauch

12-12-1999 05:35:34




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 Re: Why Buy Overbore Sleeves and Pistons in reply to Brian Schmidt, 12-11-1999 22:08:37  
The sleeves are wet sleeves, and are very thick wall, compared to sleeves you may have seen to repair overbored blocks. I can't imagine that they would flex, or strain enough to measure. The added power will produce more heat, but that would only be noticeable under full throttle, for sustained periods of time. You did not mention bearing load, which is increased with overbore, but appearantly this is over engineered, as I remember these kits being installed in local tractors when I was a kid, and worked hard.

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RIckB.

12-12-1999 04:40:44




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 Re: Why Buy Overbore Sleeves and Pistons in reply to Brian Schmidt, 12-11-1999 22:08:37  
Whatever sleeves you end up buying, make sure they are for a 'C', not a Super C. The lower sleeve bore in the C block has a smaller diameter than the Super block and will not accept Super sleeves. This is not to say you can't find 3-1/8 bore sleeves, they just need to fit a C block.



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Brian Schmidt Hey Big Fred???

12-12-1999 09:06:35




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 Re: Re: Why Buy Overbore Sleeves and Pistons in reply to RIckB., 12-12-1999 04:40:44  
I did not know that. Thanks for avoiding me a possibly costly problem.



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RED Blooded

12-12-1999 04:27:25




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 Re: Why Buy Overbore Sleeves and Pistons in reply to Brian Schmidt, 12-11-1999 22:08:37  
The overbore kit has benn avavilable for years as a means of uping the HP without buying a new tractor.You should be ok using the overbore kit.Ive had overbore kits,we call themn SUPER kits here at home,in both of my 41 Ms for years and never had any problems.



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Paul Fox

12-12-1999 04:04:49




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 Re: Why Buy Overbore Sleeves and Pistons in reply to Brian Schmidt, 12-11-1999 22:08:37  
Those are all intelligent, logical concerns. My only input would be that most tractor engines are built with a HUGE margin of safety.

I put an overbore kit in my F14 because I couldn't find a standard bore kit. It is supposed to give a 4 HP increase, which is substantial for an engine rated at 14 HP to begin with.

I haven't had any problems with overheating. I hooked her up to a 2-14 plow for about an hour a couple of weeks ago, and the temp never got over 160, altho I did have to crack the shutters a bit.

I don't know about the Super C particularly, but I'd expect you'd be safe to put in the overbore kit. The only possible exception to that opinion would be if you're planning to work the tractor at or near the limit all the time. Also, make sure the cooling system is in good shape.

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D.C.

12-15-1999 19:06:45




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 Re: Re: Why Buy Overbore Sleeves and Pistons in reply to Paul Fox, 12-12-1999 04:04:49  
Question for Paul Fox I am restoring an F-14. I was wondering if sleeves for a "C" have the same O.D. as ones for the F-14. I would like to put a 3 1/8" over bore kit w/ step head pistons for a "C" in my F-14. Any problems?



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Steve T

12-12-1999 06:46:17




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 Re: Re: Why Buy Overbore Sleeves and Pistons in reply to Paul Fox, 12-12-1999 04:04:49  
I had thought that the reason for an over bore kit was to give new life for the block. Isnt the block itself bored a little bigger so that the new sleave seals have a new surface with out rust pits and such to seal against? I havent had the chance to call a machine shop to ask yet. But it makes sense that if the sleaves have bigger pistons, then the sleaves them selves are bigger. I picked up a 1940 "A" last summer that is getting water in the oil pan, and Im afraid to take it apart to see why. A lot of your older farmers never used antifreeze in their tractors and would fill them up in the summer with water, and drain them out just before winter. I suspect that My "A" has some rust between the sleaves and the block, and an oversize sleave would take care of this. O.K. Tractor Guys, is this correct thinking, or am I the only one left standing out in the field? BTW, My dad still to this day fills his old JD "AR" up every summer with water, and to me this is serious tractor abuse, maybe Ill get him a few gallons of antifreeze for x-mas.
Steve T

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Bill Brauch

12-12-1999 14:03:22




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 Re: Re: Re: Why Buy Overbore Sleeves and Pistons in reply to Steve T, 12-12-1999 06:46:17  
Antifreeze will rust the cooling system, but not as fast as water. Water cools better than antifreeze, but antifreexe boils at a higher temperature. if the antifreexe boils over, it will cause a bigger mess than water. I use antifreeze in the machines that are tight, and water in the ones that leak.



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bigger I.D., same O.D.

12-12-1999 07:31:35




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 Re: Re: Re: Why Buy Overbore Sleeves and Pistons in reply to Steve T, 12-12-1999 06:46:17  
zx



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jakee

12-12-1999 16:58:11




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Why Buy Overbore Sleeves and Pistons in reply to bigger I.D., same O.D., 12-12-1999 07:31:35  
ran into same type trouble with a old 1940,s A.over bore kit would not fit in the block.decided to turn down out side of sleve but then found out out side was tapered from about the half way point down, could have set up boring bar and made block larger down inside.but would it hold the O ring the right way?just found a stock kit and put it in.maybee later they cast the block,s larger for just that reason.

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RickB.

12-13-1999 15:58:59




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Why Buy Overbore Sleeves and Pistons in reply to jakee, 12-12-1999 16:58:11  
You have discovered the difference between a block intended for a 113 cid engine (A, SuperA, B,C) and one for 123cid (Super C; Super A-1).



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