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Tight lift-all pump?

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Bergen

01-26-2001 05:35:46




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Upon replacing the two gaskets and the seal on my Super H's lift all(not live), I put the lift all back in the tractor. I started the tractor and when I was engaging the clutch, the tractor almost died! The pump was TIGHT! I thought a chip of metal was in between the teeth, so I took the actual pump apart to inspect it. I did find the tip of the screwdriver I used to jam the gear teeth while taking the coupling nut off so I could replace the seal(laughter... a scared sort of laughter...). Anyway, I put the pump cover on and tightened up the eight bolts and still the pump was too tight to move. loosen bolts, try again, same result. tried that a couple of times. the last time I tried that, I tightened each bolt slowly and the gears turned reasonably well, until I got where I wanted the bolts to be and at that moment the pump again tightened or seized up. The pump worked excellent before I replaced the seal and gaskets. I'm thinking that there must be a burr on the bottomside of the gears that is causing the binding, but I became discouraged and didn't want to take the pump apart again, plus I figured you guys could come up with some ideas. Also, is there a specific torque that the pump cover bolts are supposed to have?

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Theman

01-26-2001 11:27:35




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 Re: Tight lift-all pump? in reply to Bergen, 01-26-2001 05:35:46  
Since the pump shaft turns right up to final torque, I would not suspect the gears. There may be an end-play issue that hasn't been addressed yet. Is the new gasket the same thickness as the old one? Perhaps the cover you are tightening down is moving in too close. In some cases, (may not apply here) shimming with gaskets of varying thicknesses have been used by many manufacturers to control clearances. I found this out the hard way on a mower gearbox. Had way too much slop until I started peeling layers off of the gasket until backlash was perfect. An old mechanic friend told me about this. It turned out to be four separate gaskets.

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Bergen

01-26-2001 15:20:16




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 Re: Re: Tight lift-all pump? in reply to Theman, 01-26-2001 11:27:35  
The gaskets and seal I replaced were the manifold and oil resevoir gasket and the seal on the input coulpling nut. I'm quite sure I screwed(pardon the pun) things up when I jammed the gears with the screwdriver to take off the coupling nut to replace the seal. The tip that broke off the screwdriver is what is causing the current problem. I pretty sure of this because the pump was excellent before I messed with it. I think Murphy's law applies at a time like this. Thankfully, though, I didn't break any housings.

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The Red

01-26-2001 06:18:05




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 Re: Tight lift-all pump? in reply to Bergen, 01-26-2001 05:35:46  
Sounds like a gear tooth problem somewhere. At least you are getting good practice at installing and removing. :(



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Dick Davis

01-27-2001 03:20:08




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 Re: Re: Tight lift-all pump? in reply to The Red, 01-26-2001 06:18:05  
Jeez Red, how much practice does a guy need on removing a belly pump. :-(



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Haas

01-26-2001 05:46:45




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 Re: Tight lift-all pump? in reply to Bergen, 01-26-2001 05:35:46  
I have never thought sticking a screwdriver in the gears to hold them to get the coupling off was a good idea. Have you taken the gears out and examined them? Seems to me you have a damaged gear or maybe something else in there. Those tolerances are real close in there, so everything has to be clean.



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Bergen

01-26-2001 08:08:49




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 Re: Re: Tight lift-all pump? in reply to Haas, 01-26-2001 05:46:45  
I did take the gears out and inspect them. There was one burr I filed off. I thought I solved the problem. I pretty sure the whole problem started when the screwdriver tip broke off. The I&T shop manual said to use a 3/8? inch steel bar to jam the teeth, but I figured that a large screwdriver would work just as well. Needless to say, I found out different. It is a Craftsman screwdriver so it looks like I'll have to get myself mentally ready to go into the Sears store and not buy anything: ) I'll take it apart again and see if I missed something on the gears.

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Bob M

01-26-2001 11:20:13




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 Re: Re: Re: Tight lift-all pump? in reply to Bergen, 01-26-2001 08:08:49  
Bergen - When I did the cam gear replacement on my SM an old-timer recommended locking the gear train by sticking an old leather glove (NOT one of the wife's good ones...) in the gear mesh. Tried it and it worked great - locked the gears even while tightening the nut to 200 ft-lb, yet let go instantly afterward and caused no damage to the gears.



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Harold Hubbard

01-27-2001 05:11:44




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Tight lift-all pump? in reply to Bob M, 01-26-2001 11:20:13  
Same idea as stuffing clothesline into a small engine cylinder to lock the crankshaft while you loosen the flywheel nut.



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The Red

01-26-2001 11:01:44




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 Re: Re: Re: Tight lift-all pump? in reply to Bergen, 01-26-2001 08:08:49  
That's the nice thing about Sears. They always asked what warrantied item I broke this week....



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rhudson

01-26-2001 16:41:42




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Tight lift-all pump? in reply to The Red, 01-26-2001 11:01:44  
lately the tips on craftsman screwdrivers seem to break off if you look at them crosseyed. anyway on the pump, sometimes i blue parts with machinest layout dye (dyekem?). then assemble parts and run them in. the dye will be scraped/worn off where they rub or scrape.



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