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Rules opinions

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NATPA puller 2

10-02-2002 07:39:18

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Hey guys I didn't mean to start a Bill BEAR bashing party. I think if you all read DIV 5 rules his tractor is probably legal. I was concernd about the way the matter has been handled (ex) adding speed limits and the manifold issue's to try to fix a problem that the rules wouldn't let them. I'm not sure there were any problems to begin with other than BEAR has found a new legal way to make H.P. and I thought thats what DIV 4&5 were about. JUST A PULLERS THOUGHTS.

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1206SWMO

10-03-2002 18:03:40

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Re: rules opinions in reply to NATPA puller 2, 10-02-2002 07:39:18

I'm just curious as to how much more power Bear will be making with his new set up versus building the same cubic inch motor using a 301 IH gas engine with the original head.

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Seamo

10-02-2002 20:42:18

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Re: rules opinions in reply to NATPA puller 2, 10-02-2002 07:39:18

Can you mix and match Agco Tractors In Div 5 they are the same company???

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10-02-2002 13:28:22

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Re: rules opinions in reply to NATPA puller 2, 10-02-2002 07:39:18

The heads are FORD Heads. They are not IH heads.

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Drew

10-02-2002 13:59:47

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Re: Re: rules opinions in reply to ., 10-02-2002 13:28:22

Ford/New Holland owns Case/IH, so that would kind of make them from the same manufacture, right? ;)

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10-02-2002 14:47:43

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Re: Re: Re: rules opinions in reply to Drew, 10-02-2002 13:59:47

You are right. My mistake. Mr Bear is legal.

Bill Bear has changed antique pulling. He has raised the bar to a new height and we all know how he is doing it. It's time to open up our wallets and make our tractors as strong as his. I'm sure that we can not only meet his challenge, we can kick his a$$. He might be "the one to beat" now, but that will change soon.

Let's keep Div 4 as it is, but Div 5 is now a money race and Bill has the early lead.

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sebastien

10-02-2002 13:05:20

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Re: rules opinions in reply to NATPA puller 2, 10-02-2002 07:39:18

if you can find some parts for a 1947 cocksutt 70
can you e-mail me. tanks

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toby

10-02-2002 12:51:07

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Re: rules opinions in reply to NATPA puller 2, 10-02-2002 07:39:18

I would rule that he is legal. Is the crankshafts that most of us are running a replacement by the manfacture. plus a lot of other parts that are used in div 4 & 5. I think anyone can do the same thing and be legal all it takes is money which we all know high performace and new idea's ARE EXPENSIVE If any one can"t stand the heat get out of the kitchen. I think the RPM deal and speed limit is a lot more out of line than the head deal. A DIV 5 PULLER (TOBY)

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replacement

10-02-2002 07:57:26

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Re: rules opinions in reply to NATPA puller 2, 10-02-2002 07:39:18

U left the word replacement out of your statement. Bear's Cylinder head is not a manufactures "replacement". ie you would not get that head from the local IHC tenneco dealer.
This is the average puller well placed stance on the situation.

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10-02-2002 19:09:55

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Re: Re: rules opinions in reply to replacement, 10-02-2002 07:57:26

And what about Case tractors running a machined crankshaft from billet. It's been going on for a while now, yet it hasn't been an issue or the JD heads (obviously not available at the time G's were manufactured)..... ..... ..I would say time spent on this post whinning is not time spent in the shop improving. LEAD, follow or get out of the way - board members are elected right?

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CALL the board!

10-02-2002 12:19:23

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Re: Re: rules opinions in reply to replacement, 10-02-2002 07:57:26

Call Burch,Wenzig,Roorda,Crum,Boehler,Leek,etc...tell them it is not fair all div 4 and 5 guys are taking the punishment cause they are too afraid to stand up to Bear!! They need to get him out of there!! Get this chopped head issue solved or more models will be cutting heads apart!!

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ALSO A PULLER

10-02-2002 09:01:26

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Re: Re: rules opinions in reply to replacement, 10-02-2002 07:57:26

DIV 5 reads as so. Heads,blocks (jugs),manifolds must be of the same manufacturer as the crank case OR THAT OF A RECOGNIZED REPACEMENT MANUFACTURER. Even if the heads are put together as long as they our IH. they are legal. just an opinion.

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Phil Munson

10-02-2002 10:55:02

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Re: Re: Re: rules opinions in reply to ALSO A PULLER, 10-02-2002 09:01:26

The head components in question are described to be something, coming acrossed the parts counter, that would not "bolt up" to any tractor; Div I through Div V. Everything that has been said describes it to be a "friggin riggin", machined and extensively altered.

The fact that the NATPA board has acted in the self interest of fellow board members, rather than that of the NATPA organization's interest, demonstrates that they, the board, might be better qualified to participate in corporate organizations like ENRON, ETC, ETC. If the NATPA members do not replace this board, the organization's future, regrettably, is not promising.

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replacement

10-02-2002 09:27:46

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Re: Re: Re: rules opinions in reply to ALSO A PULLER, 10-02-2002 09:01:26

Well then is a V-8 head that has been chopped up and brazed back together a manufactures replacement. Sounds like a alot of custom machine shop work too me. Not something from a IHC parts book.

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ALSO A PULLER

10-02-2002 10:19:24

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Re: Re: Re: Re: rules opinions in reply to replacement, 10-02-2002 09:27:46

I know it's spliting hairs, but it's the way you look at the rules they didn't put in enough detail, if you cut up 6 different heads and then put them back together as long as all 6 were IH then your legal according to there rules.

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replacement

10-02-2002 11:39:55

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: rules opinions in reply to ALSO A PULLER, 10-02-2002 10:19:24

"also puller" is a card carring member of the Ohio Mafia.

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ALSO A PULLER

10-02-2002 13:15:08

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: rules opinions in reply to replacement, 10-02-2002 11:39:55

Just to let you know I pull J.D. GREEN and I only go to ohio to pull. Like I said I not trying to start anything I'm just trying to give an impartial view. THANKS

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art

10-02-2002 18:04:06

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: rules opinions in reply to ALSO A PULLER, 10-02-2002 13:15:08

Sounds like the div 5 pullers have no beef with the head. How many of those complaining about the heads even pull in div5? For the record the are practically NO parts on a division 5 engine that come from a farm impliment dealer. Art

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ol George

10-02-2002 21:07:20

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: rules opinions in reply to art, 10-02-2002 18:04:06

Just wondering if that means I can take a set of cat heads and fixem' for the old Wauk.

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other Divisions

10-02-2002 21:05:17

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: rules opinions in reply to art, 10-02-2002 18:04:06

no not all of us pull div.5, why should we let wing-nuts with a pile o money and an ego problem ruin the whole works? Why should other divisions pay the insurance of these unsafe ya-hoo's

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Jim

10-03-2002 18:33:19

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: rules opinions in reply to other Divisions, 10-02-2002 21:05:17

I agree. One accident with one of those hot rods and we can all sell our tractors for scrap.

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10-03-2002 06:11:03

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: rules opinions in reply to other Divisions, 10-02-2002 21:05:17

wah,wah,wah,wah.....you're old div 2 tractor can shell just as easy!!

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hey art the expert

10-02-2002 18:57:44

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: rules opinions in reply to art, 10-02-2002 18:04:06

stay in your own new classes and leave us alone! did you call gingerich to get an idea as to what to say, did he program you like the old days!

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Joe

10-02-2002 18:51:58

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: rules opinions in reply to art, 10-02-2002 18:04:06

And I highly doubt that the head is the only thing on Bear's or any other div 3 and up tractor that has not had extensive machine shop work done to it.

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