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Ring end gap

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m6

02-25-2003 03:57:37




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I was wondering if anyone had any idea on ring end gaps. We just poured our block solid and needed to get it rehoned (we were getting some water leakage between the sleeve and the block). We are at 4 5/8" and the ring end gap on most of my rings is now between .037 and .o42 - our machine shop says that .035 is probably the max we would want to go with or we'll get more blow-by than we really want, but I was just looking for some 2nd opinions on the matter. We only have 2 seasons one thos old rings and they're in great shape - probably only 30 runs on them or so - seems a shame to have to toss them. They tell us that the pistons will still work fine for us though since we need a little extra room for heat expansion anyways.

Thanks for any meaningful and useful input.

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Earl S.

02-25-2003 16:29:12




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 Re: Ring end gap in reply to m6, 02-25-2003 03:57:37  
Most piston ring manufactures ask for MINIMUM of .004 gap for every inch of cylinder dia. Example 4in. bore x .004 = .016 min. gap. For each .001 you increase the bore diam. you will gain .003 in gap. Hope this helps. Earl



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TimC

02-25-2003 06:35:11




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 Re: Ring end gap in reply to m6, 02-25-2003 03:57:37  
If your pistons are from J-E or Aries or one of the other mfgs that produce a high silicon piston then your pistons should work just fine. They can handle the higher heat due to the extra sand but a little extra clearance would help. You didn't mention the compression you are running so that is a factor also. If you are over 300 psi i would think that would factor in on the heat gain.

The rings however were not intended to gain that much heat. The pistons have no problem retaining the extra heat but the rings tend to suffer. They had an endgap factor that you figure per inch of piston when you bought them. Now that you don't have any water behind them you will probably need a little extra gap. If you are not using the (spelling/wording?) hyper-utectic pistons then you might go a little closer on the ring gap.
In any case i wouldn't pull back to back pulls until it cools a little and i would use an anti friction additive.

Just an opinion, it would be wise to talk to someone that has experiance with hard block.
Some people would also tell you that you would have to talk to a Div 5 winner but actually, most of them do not build their own engines. Find out who their engine builders is and talk to someone with years of building under their belt.

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m6

02-26-2003 04:21:13




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 Re: Re: Ring end gap in reply to TimC, 02-25-2003 06:35:11  
The engine is a diesel - sometimes turbo, sometimes non-turbo. Compression ratio is 17.5/1. The pistons are cat pistons - nothing fancy. I'm sure we have enough end gap - I just don't want to have too much end gap and end up with excessive blow by.

Thanks.



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TimC

02-26-2003 06:18:06




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 Re: Re: Re: Ring end gap in reply to m6, 02-26-2003 04:21:13  
Rings shouldn't be all that expensive. I would have the block honed on a machine that is using the good Sunnen stones. Then fit the new rings on each cyl. Wow, 17.5 and a compressor..... Would like to see it smoking and pulling that box to the top.



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m6

02-26-2003 08:14:45




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Ring end gap in reply to TimC, 02-26-2003 06:18:06  
Well.... we have it wastgated to only around 5 lb boost for 5500lbs, and 10 lbs from 65-8500 lb classes. It's more like a really good breating non-turbo than a turbo tractor. Best thing is that we don't need to sit at the line and build boost for 15 seconds - and if we need to back off of it at some point during the pull it has no problem keeping that low boost anyways and picks right back up - lots of torque :) We can ease it off the line and then get on it down the track if needed and it picks right up. We can pull the same classes in about the same gear both turbo and non (until we get to 8500), but it has a lot more zip with the turbo. We don't run it that much with the turbo though - it was primarily designed to run non.

We did have the block to the machine shop and it was machine honed. I think we'll probably put new rings in it and just be done with it - don't like tearing it down every winter just for fun.

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Eric V.

02-25-2003 07:41:30




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 Re: Re: Ring end gap in reply to TimC, 02-25-2003 06:35:11  
so you are an expert engine builder? so just div 5 guys don't build their own engines? you must then build your own car/truck too that you drive cause low and behold, you wouldn't use anything you didn't build! some people are probably just not so hung up on themselves like you and get it done right instead of acting like they know what they are doing and never really even pulling! just type those keys and tell all the pullers (div 1-5) how to do it! maybe attend some of these events, set up a consulting booth in the corner, and give advise all day long! we are so lucky for your knowledge! thank you, thank you, thank you. whoever your buddies are they are blessed to have you so close to them! (what an asset you must be) do all their tractors say special thanks to timothy c for his ideas

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