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Tractor Pulling Discussion Forum

Custom gears for Farmall

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ChadS

01-17-2004 20:39:24

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Been throwing around the idea of making custom transmission gears for H-450.. Just need some input,, What is it you guys are always looking for? Faster, or slower gears? I was thinking of offering a faster 1st kit, and maybe a faster 3rd and 4th for Higher HP tractors. Nothing written in stone just yet,, Coming soon, So you guys tell me,,, If you guys want to customize gearing in farm stock or modified tractors,, what would be a popular choice? Fast, or slow. Let's not make this a discussion on what is stock or not,, that is what makes it custom. Any input would be fine!! I am making a set of faster 3rd gear and 4th for my H,, Something different. Thanks, ChadS

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M-6

01-19-2004 05:47:49

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Re: Custom gears for Farmall in reply to ChadS, 01-17-2004 20:39:24

We'd need a little faster than super M 4th gear for our M. Already has a faster ring and pinion & super M 4th - need more speed. Big problem is breaking off 4th gear when the shaft flexes and puts stress on gear tips. Any ideas of putting a bearing in there to reduce flex and maybe a little wider gear. Was thinking of eliminating 5th gear(I think) and doubling up 2 4th gears to give added strength, and then finding a way to support shaft to eliminate the flexing. Could still use a little more speed, but that would work for a while. We've just been pulling in 3rd and been doing okay - but have the juice to handle 4th+ up to 8,500 lbs. Probably next weakest point after that would be constant mesh. Friend has tried a 9-speed in his with simlar set-up, but has bent them and they slip out of gear once in a while - IH gears must be stronger.

Have heard that some old car engine modified tractors that used M rears used to add a bearing in the middle of the shaft to eliminate the flex - any thoughts? Super M gears ain't cheap!

M-6

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01-19-2004 08:59:14

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Re: Re: Custom gears for Farmall in reply to M-6, 01-19-2004 05:47:49

What kind of engine set-up are your running to be able to pull 4th gear in 8500!!?? 600 cubes?

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ChadS

01-19-2004 07:21:25

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Re: Re: Custom gears for Farmall in reply to M-6, 01-19-2004 05:47:49

I had that happen with my H trying to pull heavy and run fast at the same time, I snapped the constant mesh gear, and bent the shafts!! I run light classes now,,, saves strain,, I did go through the rear end and trannny, all new bearings, shafts,, well everything.... I have ran back in the heavy classes with it and had no problems yet. What I see is happening is that the tires are back feeding into the transmission and differential. Not trying to sell anything, but a posi would help with the back feed.4th gear would be easy to custom make, I think that a different gear tooth pattern, and tighten up the gear mesh clearance would help keep the shaft from flexing. It will be a month or so to get this off the ground for me,, I am sure that others have done this before,, The only thing I am going to have trouble with is 5 th gear,, on the 4/5th slider, I am thinking that it will have to be a 2 piece gear, (put 2 parts to make it 1) Should know more in a week or so,, Chad

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M-6

01-20-2004 08:05:55

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Re: Re: Re: Custom gears for Farmall in reply to ChadS, 01-19-2004 07:21:25

540 cube turbo diesel. Not sure we'll need the gears anytime soon - rule changes might be happening & we may need to just find a 706 to drop it in. We're probably pushing things too far anyways.

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Chads

01-18-2004 19:21:27

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Re: Custom gears for Farmall in reply to ChadS, 01-17-2004 20:39:24

Thank you all for the input,, It seems like everyone needs a slower set of gears. OK, I have another idea on how to do this as well. There are 2 drive gears in the front of the transmission. One is off the input shaft, and the other is for the slider gears. They also reduce the engine rpm to 540 for the pto speed. It may be just as easy to change the ratio of those 2 gears and change the whole transmission gear ratio. If this is possible, I could speed up, or slow down the entire transmission. The pto speed would not be correct though,,,, Also, in the high HP tractors, it may be a good idea to make a stronger gear set for these 2 I am speaking of. HMMMMM,,,,, This may be interesting. Any thoughts??? I am going to try either method, but,, I think the front drive gears would be cheaper than replacing 3 or 4 gears just for 1st gear!!! This is something I have been planning for about a year now. Hope this works out!! Will keep you posted on the progress. Chad

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farmall

01-19-2004 06:25:15

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Re: Re: Custom gears for Farmall in reply to Chads, 01-18-2004 19:21:27

Been there done that! Changing the constent mesh gears works well. I sped mine up, and now I can run lower gears, where they are supported better.
Running the whole trans faster puts less torque on the gears because gears are spinning faster.
Hope this helps.

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ChadS

01-19-2004 07:04:34

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Re: Re: Re: Custom gears for Farmall in reply to farmall, 01-19-2004 06:25:15

It does thank you!! Is that how the 9 speeds work? Is the 2 speed change the contant mesh gear speeds?

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farmall

01-19-2004 13:46:57

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Custom gears for Farmall in reply to ChadS, 01-19-2004 07:04:34

Yes! The 9 speeds change the constent mesh gears. Thats why it's a 9 speed. 4 speed x 2 + road gear is straight through = 9 speeds. I run a M&W 9 speed and have had good luck with it. I don't understand some of the comments of 9 speeds being weak. They are actually stronger, if you think about it. Speed up the trans and put less torque thru it. As with all old tractors, the trans should be gone through & check all the bearings & gears. Also the pinion shaft front brg. They like to go bad, especially if you use 4th gear alot. Hope this helps.

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ChadS

01-19-2004 16:08:10

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Custom gears for Farmall in reply to farmall, 01-19-2004 13:46:57

Thank you. I think the 9 speeds are a pretty heavy unit from what I hear, they had 2 different styles right? a lever shift, and a cable shift. are they basicly the same unit, or is there a better one of the 2. Thank you again!! Chad

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farmall

01-21-2004 07:12:51

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Custom gears for Farmall in reply to ChadS, 01-19-2004 16:08:10

There were 2 different 9 speeds made. M&W and Heisler. Both were lever shifts, Heisler on the left side, and M&W on the right. Later M&W offered the cable shift for easier installation. The cable is a problem area, from past experience. My current pulling tractor is cable shift. I fitted a truck PTO cable that is heavier duty, and works fine. You can also rig up a lever style shift on the cable shift, because inard workings are the same. Hope this helps

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Oklahomatractorrebuilder

01-18-2004 15:36:08

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Re: Custom gears for Farmall in reply to ChadS, 01-17-2004 20:39:24

Chad I am very interested in a set of 1st gears that slow my Super M down. Also a set of 1st gears for a W-6. Want them for working not pulling. Tim

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Puller504

01-18-2004 06:02:23

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Re: Custom gears for Farmall in reply to ChadS, 01-17-2004 20:39:24

Hi Chad! I'm sitting around recovering from knee surgery (again). I'd be interested in having a gear set running 20-25% slower first gear ground speed than original for my Grandad's 1949 H that I have. Dad let it set up outside for 20 years and I'm planning on getting it running. We pull locally in the 4500# and 5000# stock classes. I would also be very interested in slowing down my AC WD's first gear 20-25% from original. This tractor has won a 4500# stock class for 3 consecutive years now but ALWAYS runs out of power on the track. I can't modify the engine as this class is only allowed 35 HP on the dyno. The AC 201 engine outlasts the H's that pull in the class, but not by much, only 6 inches 2 years ago! E-Mail me if you decide to persue this idea, thanks! Don

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Donnie

01-17-2004 21:41:44

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Re: Custom gears for Farmall in reply to ChadS, 01-17-2004 20:39:24

I've been trying to get the guy that made all my Cub Cadet gears for my Pro-Stock tractor to make them for the antiques. But he said he didn't know if he could be competitive on price. I told him as far as I know he would be the only one. Be a good way for you Chad to break that part of the market open. Might not have to hunt for the 9 speeds all the time. I would think faster would be better my self. But alot of guys hunt for the slow ones too.

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ChadS

01-17-2004 21:58:34

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Re: Re: Custom gears for Farmall in reply to Donnie, 01-17-2004 21:41:44

I have been looking at finding someone to make them, but where ever I looked , nothing, So,,, I have to do it myself,, HAHA,, I am able to cut them, just have to figure the ratio

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01-18-2004 13:59:48

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Re: Re: Re: Custom gears for Farmall in reply to ChadS, 01-17-2004 21:58:34

Why not buy a gear from Browning or another gear manufacture?You would have to use the old gear as an insert for the spline's but if you wanted enough of them they would run them with the spline.

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champspa

01-18-2004 04:24:42

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Re: Re: Re: Custom gears for Farmall in reply to ChadS, 01-17-2004 21:58:34

in the middle atlantic they are always looking for the ones just a little slower than the stock M's I think they're like 2.2 mph

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ChadS

01-18-2004 08:12:34

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Custom gears for Farmall in reply to champspa, 01-18-2004 04:24:42

At what rpm range to run 2.2mph,,, full throttle or half throttle?

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champspa

01-18-2004 14:01:24

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Custom gears for Farmall in reply to ChadS, 01-18-2004 08:12:34

It's first gear pull your allowed 10% over stock rpm. 3.5 max mph sometimes depending on the track 3 mph

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tractorboy

01-18-2004 08:52:39

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Custom gears for Farmall in reply to ChadS, 01-18-2004 08:12:34

I think a 1st gear that would be 25-30 slowwer for h & m would be well recieved for the poor boy pullers. Would make stock h & m more competitive with late syle letter series A & B deeres with 1 1/2 mph first gears in heavy classes.

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