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Do you want downward setting front end

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Puller4life

05-10-2002 21:11:49

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Is it to your advantage to have a downward frontend?

Example: going from 15" to 14" rims on the front.

Thanks

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SEAMO

05-13-2002 18:21:34

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Re: Do you want downward setting front end in reply to Puller4life, 05-10-2002 21:11:49

A simple way to have some fun and get you wondering is to get a plow bar .Thats what we called them when I was a kid on the farm. We carried them on the plow to pry the big rocks out of the ground. Get you round something to use as fulcrum point.Put a heavy weight on the end of the bar. Move the fulcrum point around as you test each lift. Now when the long part of your bar goes over center does it take more or less pressure to hold it down? Know let the bar come up level does it take more or less pressure to hold it steady? Is the rear axle the fulcrum point?Is the front end of your tractor the long part of your bar? Have fun Earl Seamands

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G Taylor

05-12-2002 09:13:04

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Re: Do you want downward setting front end in reply to Puller4life, 05-10-2002 21:11:49

If your class uses a common clevis that gets used on each tractor, then lower on the front will raise the effective hitch height. If you pull with a ring hitch, the main advantage is a lower the center of gravity.

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kspuller

05-11-2002 20:52:39

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Re: Do you want downward setting front end in reply to Puller4life, 05-10-2002 21:11:49

looks cool if nothing else

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Kurt

05-11-2002 18:10:44

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Re: Do you want downward setting front end in reply to Puller4life, 05-10-2002 21:11:49

I did it, but not for the drawbar. Every time I weighted up for a different class I had a hard time keeping the front end down. When the front comes up you lose your pulling leveredge and that would help without having to put a lot of weights up front.

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G-MAN

05-11-2002 11:12:58

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Re: Do you want downward setting front end in reply to Puller4life, 05-10-2002 21:11:49

I'm not a pulling expert by any means, but I always thought the reason for running smaller wheels/tires on the front would be to save some weight. A lower front would raise the drawbar, but like was already posted, you could do that at the drawbar. Just my two cents.

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Vic Simpson

05-11-2002 19:40:22

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Re: Re: Do you want downward setting front end in reply to G-MAN, 05-11-2002 11:12:58

Its a math problem. A tractor has a center of gravity,so far up from the ground. you want your weights as far forward and as low as possible. So when your front does come up down at the end of the track, say 6 inches it is still below the center of gravity. The result is that you are pushing down on the rear the hardest that you can. Make a model using a erector set and a postage scale. Better yet watch the winners.

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Scott Boehler

05-11-2002 22:14:49

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Re: Re: Re: Do you want downward setting front end in reply to Vic Simpson, 05-11-2002 19:40:22

This is very true it also depends on alot of variables such as wheel base,front end weight bare. If you can't ever get the front end off the ground then the front would be betterhigher than
back. Try a 2degree drop at first. Use this as a base line to see how the tractor respond's. Your
tractor weight location and hitch also will effect
this as mentioned in previous reply. If you wish to call me my phone # is on the NATPA web page and I will be glad to try to help you with this. Scott

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Hey Scott???

05-12-2002 11:39:19

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Do you want downward setting front end in reply to Scott Boehler, 05-11-2002 22:14:49

Can you tell us all what parts are legal in Div 3.
I have seen all types of block, heads, manifolds and carburetors. No one has ever been DQ for them.
I already know about the BS that we need to police ourself and go by the rules. But if we point out something that is wrong and no one cares, we are waisting our time.

If you need a more direct question, Are the JD Kanas heads legal in Div 3???? Why hasn't the NATPA enforced this rule?????

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Scott

05-12-2002 17:15:58

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Do you want downward setting front end in reply to Hey Scott???, 05-12-2002 11:39:19

Im only one person and unfortunetly I can only try
tohelp this problem. I don't like the fact that everybody says it's a John Deere and they need all the help they can get. Rules should be for all makes. Hopefully the N.A.T.P.A. will work with
the tech committee and back them up. I tried last time to implement this before and ran into all kinds of resistance. The rules are not fool proof
or black& white therfore people read in what they want.If you want to help change that is great. But if you just want to cry like the person who called me Don jr I won't even try to help correct these issue's. I do this because I enjoy pulling and want to see the sport grow. Not cry like the name caller because I don't win!!!!! !!! Scott

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Hey Scott

05-12-2002 19:21:57

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Do you want downward setting front end in reply to Scott, 05-12-2002 17:15:58

I'm not calling anybody names. I just want someone to explain the rules. A simple yes or no would be a good start.
Is the JD Kansas head legal in Div 3.

Maybe at the next pull you could get all the NATPA people together and answer this one question. There will be more question, but this is a start.

Thank

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No Scott

05-12-2002 19:16:07

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Do you want downward setting front end in reply to Scott, 05-12-2002 17:15:58

You are the answer man here we want answers.

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Scott

05-12-2002 21:07:55

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Do you want downward setting front end in reply to No Scott, 05-12-2002 19:16:07

I did not make the rules first of all.
I would say yes it is legal by the rules as writen
because it says "manufactor replacement". I will also say that I don't agree with this. But I'm sure you will crusify me any way so have fun.
Sign your name and be a man! Scott

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Slo

05-13-2002 19:24:09

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Do you want downward setting front end in reply to Scott, 05-12-2002 21:07:55

Just curious, and nothing against Deere's, but how does a Kansas head constitute a manufacturer's replacement? Time frame seems a little off. A Heisler head comes a heck of a lot closer than a Kansas head, unless you are talking about an original flathead and not one made by Jerry. Does a Lemmon's head become a manufacturer's replacement also?

Does that mean that 800 heads will become legal on MM's in div 3 since they were actually made by MM?

Not crucifying, just trying to understand.

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Scott

05-13-2002 20:53:35

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Do you want downward setting front end in reply to Slo, 05-13-2002 19:24:09

I agree with what you are saying but you know as well as I do that the 800 heads are not allowed in Div3. Does the Lemmon's head look just like the
450 Lp? That is why I said earlier that I get tired of people saying HOW CARES IT'S A JOHN DEERE AND THEY NEED ALL THE HELP THEY CAN GET.
I feel that pull the div that you belong in. Don't get me wrong I would love to pull Div 4
but my G is just not that competitive there.
But my new W-40 might just get to see this!!!!
Don't think I dont care but the rules were voted
on by the membership and the tech crew has to work with what they got. So please try to understand that they are trying to help keep thing's going in the direction that the MEMBERSHIP
voted in. Also tech people get nothing but chewed on the whole tome they are doing their job's. Scott

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Listen to Don Jr he knows.

05-12-2002 11:06:00

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Do you want downward setting front end in reply to Scott Boehler, 05-11-2002 22:14:49

#$%^&*()

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phil

05-11-2002 07:44:35

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Re: Do you want downward setting front end in reply to Puller4life, 05-10-2002 21:11:49

I think a low frontend helps only because it raises the drawbar - you would get the same result by adjusting the drawbar height. In fact the lower center of gravity might be a disadvantage, makes it slightly harder to transfer the weight to the rear tires.

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Puller

05-13-2002 13:21:00

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Re: Re: Do you want downward setting front end in reply to phil, 05-11-2002 07:44:35

I think it does help center of gravity, but as far as your drawbar height it is going to be measured when you pull across the scales at most pulls and if its over their limit you will have to lower it.

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G Taylor

05-13-2002 15:13:08

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Re: Re: Re: Do you want downward setting front end in reply to Puller, 05-13-2002 13:21:00

Lowering the front end helps the tractor pull more as it's being assisted by rolling downhill.

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Jerry B

05-14-2002 06:28:14

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Re: Re: Re: Re: Do you want downward setting front end in reply to G Taylor , 05-13-2002 15:13:08

G Taylor,
I hope you said that with "tongue-in-cheek". :)

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buckmaster700

05-11-2002 04:31:00

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Re: Do you want downward setting front end in reply to Puller4life, 05-10-2002 21:11:49

yes it will help doit if you can

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puller4life

05-13-2002 20:16:32

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Re: Re: Do you want downward setting front end in reply to buckmaster700, 05-11-2002 04:31:00

Thanks for you alls help and info.

Thanks again.

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