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Fuel efficiency in old versus new diesel tractors

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jdemaris

12-15-2007 11:11:20




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We had a discussion a day or so ago in the Deere forum about diesel tractors and efficiency. Also discussed were Deere two-cylinder diesels being high, even by today's standards.

Some of the newest tractors have broken fuel-efficiency records at certain power levels - mostly new Deeres. However, those figures drop like a rock at lower power levels.

Previously, I thought the old Nebraska tests did not check for fuel efficiency at lower power ratings - but I just found out they did. My 1951 Tractor Field Book has complete tests for all tractors that year. Here's a comparison of a 1951 Deere R diesel two-cylinder, with a modern Case-IH CX 50. Efficiency expressed in HHGs - i.e. horsepower hours per gallon.

Deere R diesel 1951: At 43.5 horse it tested at 17.6 HHG At 33.5 horse it tested at 17 HHG At 26.5 horse it tested at 15.5 HHG At 11.3 horse it tested at 11.1 HHG At 1.6 horse it tested at 1.5 HHG

Case IH CX 50 1999: 42.5 horse at 15.2 HHG 37 horse at 14.8 HHG 28 horse at 13.5 HHG 18.9 horse at 11.1 HHG 9.5 horse at 7.9 HHG

Now, also look at the Deere 8520 that is one of the most fuel efficient tractors tested.

Deere 8520 tested 2002 292.8 horse at 18.1 HHG 113 horse at 13.2 HHG 56.7 horse at 11.3 HHG 1 horse at 3/10 HHG (pretty bad)

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fixerupper

12-15-2007 17:24:58




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 Re: Fuel efficiency in old versus new diesel tractors in reply to jdemaris, 12-15-2007 11:11:20  
The fact that the R is not turbocharged might give it a little advantage on light loads.

I used to pull a six row cultivator with a 1070 Case, which was almost an unnoticeable load. I usually ran half throttle at the most. Then I traded the 1070 for a 1086 IH and when the 1086 pulled the same cultivator it used more fuel per hour. Under a full load was a whole different story, with the non-turbo'd 1070 using about the same amount of fuel to get 108 horses as the turboed 1086 did to get 135 horses. The difference might also have been because they were two different breeds of animal from the ground up instead of just turbo/non-turbo. Jim

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phillip d

12-15-2007 15:47:48




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 Re: Fuel efficiency in old versus new diesel tractors in reply to jdemaris, 12-15-2007 11:11:20  
There are a few guys around here trading in the Deere's for Challenger's.One guy claims his Cat burns 70 liter's a day(more than 15 gallons) less on a 6 sod plow,the same mph,rpm and hours at it than a Case,and a Deere.Money talks,he has 3 of them now.



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RodInNS

12-15-2007 12:53:16




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 Re: Fuel efficiency in old versus new diesel tractors in reply to jdemaris, 12-15-2007 11:11:20  
That little case certainly wasn't all that efficient at only 15 HHG. That would have been quite a good figure for the 70's to mid 80's...
The 'R' was good for it's time but those are only average numbers today too.
I think that most of Ford's Genesis engines would fall in about that range, and one of the most efficient tractors ever tested at Nebraska was the Ford 8870 which just about broke 20 HHG (19.98) I think was the number at rated power....
Personally I've never thought of Deeres to be particulairly efficient engines. I know they put up fancy numbers on the PTO test at nebraska at maximum power but when they get to the field in the real world they burn more fuel than most. I think it's in the numbers you've shown at part load. They get awful poor in that working range and most I've seen seem to find themselves beside the fuel tank a lot more than their competition.
You don't by chance have the test handy for the 4440?

Rod

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jdemaris

12-15-2007 17:28:07




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 Where do you get that? in reply to RodInNS, 12-15-2007 12:53:16  
How can the Ford 8870 be the most efficient (tested in 1996) when Deere's 8430 broke the world's record in 2006. 298 horse at 18.65 HHG.

I just read through some archives, and when the New Holland 8870 was tested at Nebraska asking Deere and Case, it lost to both and it was nowhere near 20 horsepower hours per gallon. Here's a piece of the article:

From Farmers Journal 1998 : "In the Nebraska tests, the New Holland 8870 were compared
with equivalent models from John Deere and Case. Across four models, the New Holland fuel
economy figures were coming in below the others in each sector. The differences ranged from
11 per cent for the smaller models to 13 per cent for the bigger ones."

And here's one about Deere breaking the fuel-efficiency record - which they broke again this year:

Fuel Efficiency Record Set By John Deere 8430 Tractor In Nebraska Test Lab LENEXA, KS (July 14, 2006) — John Deere recently tested an 8430 Tractor, rated at
250-PTO hp, at the Nebraska Tractor Test Lab in Lincoln, Neb. to independently verify fuel
efficiency, power, and performance. Record-setting results were returned for fuel efficiency on
the 8430 Tractor with Automatic PowerShift Transmission (PST) for power produced to fuel
consumed of any row crop tractor ever test
The tractor was equipped with an Automatic PowerShift transmission and tested at 100 percent
PTO load at rated engine speed. The record result of 18.65 Hp.-hr./Gallon was achieved.
Previously, the 8520 Tractor with the same equipment had test results of 17.13 Hp.-hr./Gallon.
This 8.8 percent improvement is now the benchmark for tractor fuel efficiency performance in a
row crop tractor.

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RodInNS

12-15-2007 18:04:50




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 Re: Where do you get that? in reply to jdemaris, 12-15-2007 17:28:07  
I'll have to look tomorrow and see if I can find exactly what that test entailed on the 8870. I do know that that figure was prominent in their advertizing at the time. It may have been at only one specific load or speed. I don't remember now... but I will look and find it. I rather think the figures were on Nebraska's web page a few years ago if you want to look there.

I'm on my way out the door in a few minutes, so I won't look until tomorrow.

Rod

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comfortking

12-15-2007 15:14:27




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 Re: Fuel efficiency in old versus new diesel tractors in reply to RodInNS, 12-15-2007 12:53:16  

See if you can find the numbers for a Case 1175 vs a 4430 or 4440. We ran a 1175 against both JDs pulling 6 plows and the Case always paid labor plus on fuel savings. We also ran a 4-150 White and an 8430 JD and the White would save enough on fuel each day to pay labor and then some, pulled 7-18s onland hitch with both.



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dlplost

12-15-2007 12:17:14




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 Re: Fuel efficiency in old versus new diesel tractors in reply to jdemaris, 12-15-2007 11:11:20  
it's all in the RPM's. in the example you can see that the "R" is rated at about 1,000 for all loads, what are the newer ones turning to get the same HP??

Newer engines turn at a higher rpm to get the same HP, more rpms = more fuel...



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Jon Hagen

12-15-2007 11:48:39




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 Re: Fuel efficiency in old versus new diesel tractors in reply to jdemaris, 12-15-2007 11:11:20  
The R and I seem to remember the 730 were the best for economy. In your opinion JD, what was it about those old 2 cyl diesels that allowed them to be the economy champs for so many years ?
Is it something about two big slow turning cylinders VS 4 or 6 high speed cylinders ?

They clanked,they rattled, and the pony start was kind of a complicated PITA, but they sure could squeeze a lot of work out of a gallon of fuel.

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jdemaris

12-15-2007 17:35:51




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 Re: Fuel efficiency in old versus new diesel tractors in reply to Jon Hagen, 12-15-2007 11:48:39  
My wife's father is a retired auto-engine-engineer. According to his opinion and experience - large combustion chambers have always resulted in the best fuel efficiecy - i.e. two big cylinders in the Deere, as opposed to later engines with many small cylinders. But, the drawback to the two-cylinder is the lack of versatility and RPMs limitations. Those figures for the old Deeres are pretty impressive condidering they are not far off from the current world's record.

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135 Fan

12-15-2007 18:04:38




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 Re: Fuel efficiency in old versus new diesel tractors in reply to jdemaris, 12-15-2007 17:35:51  
A 3 cylinder Perkins in an MF150 held the record for a long time. All the tractors with the AD3-152 were close behind. For the older technology there weren't too many tractors that got over 15. Dave



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